Ares Posted October 9, 2016 Report Posted October 9, 2016 Bottom line of the story, removing party system in PvP Ladder won't resolve any of your issues. People can still make way to gang on a group of people.
rrrrrram0n Posted October 9, 2016 Report Posted October 9, 2016 The one who cant stay alive without pally? Not sure about you because I have no idea who you are but i've been here since the start of the server and back then the best part was when ladder reset and all groups would gather up there friends and make a 10-15 man party and have a huge brawl over the weekend with 2-3k+ kills on #1. Unfortunately now the skill of players has deteriorated and there isn't a lot of competition left.
Inflatable Sheep Posted October 9, 2016 Author Report Posted October 9, 2016 Bottom line of the story, removing party system in PvP Ladder won't resolve any of your issues. People can still make way to gang on a group of people. It will, actually. Having a few players trying to attack you at once is one thing, but adding Devo changes that equation completely, not to mention friendly fire, etc. If you really want another Group vs Group event, then implement Battlegrounds...
c0okiee Posted October 9, 2016 Report Posted October 9, 2016 (edited) Hello If i remember correctly, it was on 2014 when PvP ladder features were changed (the use of @storage and parties inside) to promote more participation at the time the change was made, the tokens only were useful to get prizes from token traders room (wings to complete a certain color aura set and other type of wings) however, the pvp tokens are more worth now since they are used in quest for dragonist armor, making some players monopolize and elevate the prize of them. As discussed previously with other GMs on our Super Secret GM Discussion Thread ( :th_heh:), I think disabling parties (or at least disabling the use of devotion) inside PvP Room might better the situation, Givin a fair chance to all players (even the ones that want to test themselves and go there alone). Sure people will keep making teams and try to gang rivals, but its more easy to go 1 vs 5 (as an example) if the gang is not protected by a pally all the time. The feeding problem is another story, but I think the responible GM about checking that (GM Dream) does a fantastic work on that matter. Plus, if this change means more participation from our comunity, that might translate on more players keeping eyes open in case someone tries to cheat the ladder. This is just mi opinion on the "parties inside pvp room". I already made other suggestions on the aforementioned topic with the GM Team, however I won't post here to prevent any derailment of the discussion. Id +1 this make Devotion skill unavailable then even if parties existed ppl cld still have some fun caz u have a chance at killing players atleast and no devotion isnt a requirement for any class if u ask me all classes can find a way to pvp by their own skills and survive Pally still has battle chant which can help party members so they arent useless without devotion But Party system is good that way i wldnt kill friendlies by mistake XD Edited October 9, 2016 by c0okiee
Danger Posted October 9, 2016 Report Posted October 9, 2016 Bottom line of the story, removing party system in PvP Ladder won't resolve any of your issues. People can still make way to gang on a group of people. I beg to differ Even if people manage to gang You without a Party, You might have more chances against them than against a player that is ultra-buffed/devo-ed by a Paladin alone How can you beat someone that has an (almost) infinite supply of HP? You have to worry about attacking and healing yourself while your adversary only worries about attacking. Take for example a battle against an Asura Champ, It's not the same if you manage to get him with you to the grave by reflect (both of you get a kill count) than if only you die (because devo protected him) Another example is kihop from taekwons and Star Gladiators which increases attack a 10% (at max lvl) from each party member. it becomes more difficult to survive a huge buff like that passive or battle chant (200% atk) Those are buffs not intended to be available on a equal fight. they are intended for scenarios like GvG or WoE (even BR) where a team of few can manage to kill a greater group thanks to said buffs, not when a group of few needs to hoard the top spot on a ladder.
p3wp3w Posted October 9, 2016 Report Posted October 9, 2016 Id still believe disabling party systrm on PvP room will make a huge change
Danger Posted October 9, 2016 Report Posted October 9, 2016 But Party system is good that way i wldnt kill friendlies by mistake XD That's part of the fun, just like in recent events (Emperium race, Circle of Madness to name an example) :th_heh:
c0okiee Posted October 9, 2016 Report Posted October 9, 2016 (edited) well yea id love to kill friends in fun events :D especially MAI she always kills me or cheats! but in pvp for like serious fights its good to have a party system or stuff just goes haywire and the drama begins :( i love pvp but ppl take it srsly sometimes though its a game so party system existing in pvp is no biggie according to me All i want to do is pew pew as much as i can and die anyway wotever decision is made regarding this topic im kewl wid it :D Edited October 9, 2016 by c0okiee
c0okiee Posted October 9, 2016 Report Posted October 9, 2016 why not make LMS reward like 1 pvp tok its like a frequent event ull see half server in there everytime then and no party system so ppl be going ape shit crazy XD well pvp toks need to be added or rewarded through more events not just ladder pvp or its gonna make ppl go insane trying to fight for those 10 pvp toks a week lol i mean being part of a important quest it really needs to be available more than it is now 1
Inflatable Sheep Posted October 9, 2016 Author Report Posted October 9, 2016 why not make LMS reward like 1 pvp tok its like a frequent event ull see half server in there everytime then and no party system so ppl be going ape shit crazy XD well pvp toks need to be added or rewarded through more events not just ladder pvp or its gonna make ppl go insane trying to fight for those 10 pvp toks a week lol i mean being part of a important quest it really needs to be available more than it is now +9999999 Yes.
Carlo~ Posted October 9, 2016 Report Posted October 9, 2016 I agree with cookie. Maybe just disable devotion if possible. It's a player vs player after all. In that case, some players without party have higher chances of at least killing some. This also avoids friendly fire. :th_ok:
Ares Posted October 10, 2016 Report Posted October 10, 2016 I beg to differ Even if people manage to gang You without a Party, You might have more chances against them than against a player that is ultra-buffed/devo-ed by a Paladin alone How can you beat someone that has an (almost) infinite supply of HP? You have to worry about attacking and healing yourself while your adversary only worries about attacking. Take for example a battle against an Asura Champ, It's not the same if you manage to get him with you to the grave by reflect (both of you get a kill count) than if only you die (because devo protected him) Another example is kihop from taekwons and Star Gladiators which increases attack a 10% (at max lvl) from each party member. it becomes more difficult to survive a huge buff like that passive or battle chant (200% atk) Those are buffs not intended to be available on a equal fight. they are intended for scenarios like GvG or WoE (even BR) where a team of few can manage to kill a greater group thanks to said buffs, not when a group of few needs to hoard the top spot on a ladder. I was thinking more of like disabling the @storage instead of breaking the party system.
Ares Posted October 10, 2016 Report Posted October 10, 2016 why not make LMS reward like 1 pvp tok its like a frequent event ull see half server in there everytime then and no party system so ppl be going ape shit crazy XD well pvp toks need to be added or rewarded through more events not just ladder pvp or its gonna make ppl go insane trying to fight for those 10 pvp toks a week lol i mean being part of a important quest it really needs to be available more than it is now PvP Prizes are only handled by Genesis, Dream, and I. We try to control the economy for PvP Tokens especially for the Dragonist requirement we did intentionally.
Inflatable Sheep Posted October 10, 2016 Author Report Posted October 10, 2016 It's all about numbers now, I guess. Nobody takes pride in their own fighting ability on this server anymore, it all comes down to who has the bigger party. Pathetic.
Rayray Posted October 10, 2016 Report Posted October 10, 2016 So here's a point of view of someone who played in the early times of the server and played in the recent times.We used to have MASSIVE pvp battles in the pvp room. It was during those times where the pvp room map is this huge rectangular map that is sort of dark(forgot the map name but you get the point). People will be in there, mostly one guild fighting a guild they hate and vice versa. And they are all in parties. We had fun then as well. Mainly because that is the only way a wizard or some other class that is not a sinx or champ to experience decent pvp(no valk weapons so yeah, most classes are useless in pvp).Come the recent times, every other class can pvp on his own. There actually is no need for the party system since everyone can actually hold his own now(provided they use the correct gear). Of course people are gonna complain about devotion, especially when there is storage. The party system is basically this server's own version of camping in FPS games, everyone hates it, except the ones who are actually doing it.Solution? Create 2 rooms, one with party and one without. Instead of just one guy winning in the party one, make it party based and let everyone gain pvp tokens. amount of prizes should be different for both rooms but make it so that they are competitive. If one yields way too many tokens than the other, the other one will be completely empty.
Ares Posted October 10, 2016 Report Posted October 10, 2016 So here's a point of view of someone who played in the early times of the server and played in the recent times. We used to have MASSIVE pvp battles in the pvp room. It was during those times where the pvp room map is this huge rectangular map that is sort of dark(forgot the map name but you get the point). People will be in there, mostly one guild fighting a guild they hate and vice versa. And they are all in parties. We had fun then as well. Mainly because that is the only way a wizard or some other class that is not a sinx or champ to experience decent pvp(no valk weapons so yeah, most classes are useless in pvp). Come the recent times, every other class can pvp on his own. There actually is no need for the party system since everyone can actually hold his own now(provided they use the correct gear). Of course people are gonna complain about devotion, especially when there is storage. The party system is basically this server's own version of camping in FPS games, everyone hates it, except the ones who are actually doing it. Solution? Create 2 rooms, one with party and one without. Instead of just one guy winning in the party one, make it party based and let everyone gain pvp tokens. amount of prizes should be different for both rooms but make it so that they are competitive. If one yields way too many tokens than the other, the other one will be completely empty. Now that's how you give a solution to a problem. Instead of a one-sided opinion, this is more do-able.
c0okiee Posted October 10, 2016 Report Posted October 10, 2016 (edited) PvP Prizes are only handled by Genesis, Dream, and I. We try to control the economy for PvP Tokens especially for the Dragonist requirement we did intentionally. well other events like GVG and BR we have them 2ce a week why not adding another event that can do the same for pvp toks its all about supply and demand :D RayRay's suggetion might work for this another pvp room :D The way it is now id rather be fine without dragonist armors and stick with my old items because im sure no matter how much i try i wldnt be able to stay in top 3 of the pvp room every week Maybe someday i might be able to collect them maybe not lol Guess im gonna start PVP room too then or atleast try :D Edited October 10, 2016 by c0okiee
patflowers Posted October 10, 2016 Report Posted October 10, 2016 Since no one replied on my comment (lol) esp the one complaining this, i would just like to agree more of what Ray Ray just said as to what I initially did. Separate event or like LMS would be fine and still, imagine that it will be dominated by Ninjas or other OP chars. Come to think of it, it will still end in a gang to elimante certain players before they decide who to get the prize. It may not be a party like thing but can you imagine a ninja on lutie, champ provoked to lvl 10 or Wiz/Prof got mind break wiping players. Does anyone even get my point? It will still be like the set up now but will be easier at some extent...
Nas Posted October 10, 2016 Report Posted October 10, 2016 Not sure about you because I have no idea who you are but i've been here since the start of the server and back then the best part was when ladder reset and all groups would gather up there friends and make a 10-15 man party and have a huge brawl over the weekend with 2-3k+ kills on #1. Unfortunately now the skill of players has deteriorated and there isn't a lot of competition left. Please waw, you compared it with good old days? When there was no such OP item etc? Man seriously you from dinasour Fro era? I dont think i know who you are, nvm its not the issue. Back then is purest game style i ever had, less cheat, but now?ask yourself :) you know what happend surround. " Unfortunately now the skill of players has deteriorated and there isn't a lot of competition left " Uhh seriously? I thought you the one who merged,now u said u want competition? *out from issue too. P.s:Please dont compared it with good old days dude, everything was changed now.
lord_dhan26 Posted October 10, 2016 Report Posted October 10, 2016 Since no one replied on my comment (lol) esp the one complaining this, i would just like to agree more of what Ray Ray just said as to what I initially did. Separate event or like LMS would be fine and still, imagine that it will be dominated by Ninjas or other OP chars. Come to think of it, it will still end in a gang to elimante certain players before they decide who to get the prize. It may not be a party like thing but can you imagine a ninja on lutie, champ provoked to lvl 10 or Wiz/Prof got mind break wiping players. Does anyone even get my point? It will still be like the set up now but will be easier at some extent... yeah... the fact that they want to disable the party system, just to remove Devo pally... dont they think the same effect takes in their place too.. so meaning a full geared and wise ninja or anychar will dominate them, since LOL pneuma and defending aura saves them from such HOKAGE moves. leave the PVP alone... make ur own team and dominate.. Like Matt said.. the more the people against you, the more the kill count..
Xtopher Posted October 10, 2016 Report Posted October 10, 2016 The only way to make both sides happy is to have two rooms. One with normal party play and a second room that only allows two players to enter at a time for a true 1v1. If you allow more than 2 without parties people will just gangbang each other without having a party. You can still team up. Something you have to consider with a true 1v1 room is you will build a kill count MUCH more slowly than with a party fight. Only other option I see is having (3v3) (5v5) rooms etc. But that would be way too much for a GM to watch for feeders.
rrrrrram0n Posted October 10, 2016 Report Posted October 10, 2016 Please waw, you compared it with good old days? When there was no such OP item etc? Man seriously you from dinasour Fro era? I dont think i know who you are, nvm its not the issue. Back then is purest game style i ever had, less cheat, but now?ask yourself :) you know what happend surround. " Unfortunately now the skill of players has deteriorated and there isn't a lot of competition left " Uhh seriously? I thought you the one who merged,now u said u want competition? *out from issue too. P.s:Please dont compared it with good old days dude, everything was changed now. Back then is purest game style i ever had, less cheat, but now?ask yourself :) you know what happend surround. completely off topic and useless Uhh seriously? I thought you the one who merged,now u said u want competition? *out from issue too. completely off topic and useless There is literally no point in changing no party because what stops a priest from coming in and lexing your enemy or assumping you or a pally provoking you or a prof dispelling your enemy or a clown taroting enemy, disabling party will change absolutely nothing.
Nas Posted October 10, 2016 Report Posted October 10, 2016 Back then is purest game style i ever had, less cheat, but now?ask yourself :) you know what happend surround. completely off topic and useless Uhh seriously? I thought you the one who merged,now u said u want competition? *out from issue too. completely off topic and useless There is literally no point in changing no party because what stops a priest from coming in and lexing your enemy or assumping you or a pally provoking you or a prof dispelling your enemy or a clown taroting enemy, disabling party will change absolutely nothing. What a pathetic thinking. Thats why im saying that you cant stay alive without your pally. Disabling party will make people like you know what is competition. Lex,dispell? You can default to gtb all the time if u got personal slave pally, u wont be effected by those skill dude. Still disabling party will change nothing?
p3wp3w Posted October 10, 2016 Report Posted October 10, 2016 There is literally no point in changing no party because what stops a priest from coming in and lexing your enemy or assumping you or a pally provoking you or a prof dispelling your enemy or a clown taroting enemy, disabling party will change absolutely nothing. But not a Pally Devoing an ally. Additional Defensive buffs, Tanking capability, Back-up Seed Spammer. With a pally by yourside, what else would you ask for on a pvp?
Rayray Posted October 10, 2016 Report Posted October 10, 2016 The only way to make both sides happy is to have two rooms. One with normal party play and a second room that only allows two players to enter at a time for a true 1v1. If you allow more than 2 without parties people will just gangbang each other without having a party. You can still team up. Something you have to consider with a true 1v1 room is you will build a kill count MUCH more slowly than with a party fight. Only other option I see is having (3v3) (5v5) rooms etc. But that would be way too much for a GM to watch for feeders. Off topic but I miss you posting in this forums. Good to see that you visit(unless you actually play on a new character).
