plok123 Posted February 3, 2015 Report Posted February 3, 2015 It's a map where treasure box are farmed a lot, where newbies mostly do it, not really fun for them to be killed randomly. And for detale purposes, It's pretty annoying when you get killed trying to fight for an mvp coz you're not geared to tank player damage and some players are purposely there just to kill mvp hunters and the competition of their party. Ruins the mvp experience if i would say. Yeah some people are gonna go 'Stop whining and man up' bla bla, that just explains who you are in the server :) 1
Budaz Posted February 3, 2015 Report Posted February 3, 2015 I understand your point plok but, if they consider this suggestion there's gonna be toons of others for other maps I think...
plok123 Posted February 3, 2015 Author Report Posted February 3, 2015 other maps dont drop what detale drops, soooo :)
kyoshiro029 Posted February 4, 2015 Report Posted February 4, 2015 My opinion in this is half...... its okay for the new players who havent geared yet...... but...... not sure if you're up for more competition..... yes i do farm in abyss_03 and in my time there i have a fair share of what the (D)uck moments.... but it would be too hard to farm if you have too many competition..... well if the spawn and numbers are up.. then its possible... if its a bit unfair then just lessen the drop rate a bit, just a suggestion.... it is to compensate for the increase in number of acidus.... what do you think plok.... i just added this if the pvp would be dropped
Virael Posted February 4, 2015 Report Posted February 4, 2015 I understand your point plok but, if they consider this suggestion there's gonna be toons of others for other maps I think... ^ What he said. other maps dont drop what detale drops, soooo :) True. Other MVPs drop better. So if the rationale behind this is for MVP purposes, it will open up a floodgate of requests to make all the other maps with MVPs have PK turned off as well - which I don't think is feasible. Also, farming is mostly an end-game activity. Why should the difficulty curve be altered to accommodate for newbies to be able to do an end-game activity effectively?
sartorius19 Posted February 4, 2015 Report Posted February 4, 2015 ^ What he said. True. Other MVPs drop better. So if the rationale behind this is for MVP purposes, it will open up a floodgate of requests to make all the other maps with MVPs have PK turned off as well - which I don't think is feasible. Also, farming is mostly an end-game activity. Why should the difficulty curve be altered to accommodate for newbies to be able to do an end-game activity effectively? I dont really think that farming is an end-game activity unless you donate. Farming is what most of the players did when they started, when they are on average playing and even a bit on end-game. End-Game Activity would constitute mostly by PVP/GVG. Also if its end-game, i therefor conclude that you have enough resources to just buy rather than farm, right? (if you wanna save up then its a different case.) Yeah why should we? Simply because of a simple logic here, the people with high end/expensive stuffs are OPing shits and hoarding em. so people who are starting or what you can call "newbies" are having a hard time obtaining it unless otherwise through donations. As for Plok's suggestion, i myself got killed there way back when i was starting, but if you put the pk off, the competition would be very tight as many will surely farm in there knowing that they wont be killed. Besides theres a lot of maps to farm for. And other things for a newbie to get profit from. The MvPing issue is a different thing from the farming one. But i can see that EOF will surely have a price hike once its harder to obtain by force killing other MvPers. So i dont think it would be good. Its a different thing from the tur_dun03 where TG respawns, it has no other mobs used for farming. It was supposed to be one of the PK venues for players. but PK Turned off now, so no more PvPing in there.
gennova Posted February 4, 2015 Report Posted February 4, 2015 Highly agree with this. Let the price die down cause newbie can have more chance to obtain one.
Rayray Posted February 4, 2015 Report Posted February 4, 2015 Isn't this gonna make it harder for newbies to get a drop on detale if we turn off PK and make it easier for fully geared ones? Sure, getting killed there is annoying when you are hunting detale, but think of it this way: A fully geared player can easily outdamage the newbies hunting detale. With pk off, you have no way of actually trying to stop the geared player from taking the mvp. Even if you see detale first, as a newbie your damage is low compared to a fully geared player, hence you will still not get the drop even if the geared player is a bit late. While with pk off, you can try and call people and even other players killing detale might actually kill each other. I don't mind either way actually, but I see it happen with TG that the geared player always gets the drop simply because his damage is much higher than the newbies hunting TG.
gennova Posted February 4, 2015 Report Posted February 4, 2015 The fact is hurt since the geared player we are talking about bring more of his geared friend to secure the place lol.
warrior911 Posted February 4, 2015 Report Posted February 4, 2015 Isn't this gonna make it harder for newbies to get a drop on detale if we turn off PK and make it easier for fully geared ones? Sure, getting killed there is annoying when you are hunting detale, but think of it this way: A fully geared player can easily outdamage the newbies hunting detale. With pk off, you have no way of actually trying to stop the geared player from taking the mvp. Even if you see detale first, as a newbie your damage is low compared to a fully geared player, hence you will still not get the drop even if the geared player is a bit late. While with pk off, you can try and call people and even other players killing detale might actually kill each other. I don't mind either way actually, but I see it happen with TG that the geared player always gets the drop simply because his damage is much higher than the newbies hunting TG. I don't get how having PK-on would help newbies because whether PK is on or off, fully geared players would still outdamage newbies. Tho with PK-off, the newbies wouldn't have to worried about getting killed from players and it's much cheaper to get geared for MVP than PVP. It's true they wouldn't be able to stop geared players when they arrived but if the newbie arrived much earlier then at least they still get a chance to get the MVP drop Imagine a newbie almost killed Detale then a fully geared player appears, then they'd just have to kill the newbie and they get the drop. Geared players would always have the advantage since they're also likely experienced hunters. However turning PK-off would definitely help out newbies and reduce EoF monopoly but it would take out the fun of killing farmers and hunters I really don't care either since I farm, hunt, and pvp somewhere else hehehe :th_e2:
theanother Posted February 4, 2015 Report Posted February 4, 2015 -1 sorry, but this map is too good to disable pk(hence treasure hunting and detale)
Roi Posted February 5, 2015 Report Posted February 5, 2015 Mixed feelings about this suggestion, part of me says +1, part of me says -1 ...
Rayray Posted February 5, 2015 Report Posted February 5, 2015 I don't get how having PK-on would help newbies because whether PK is on or off, fully geared players would still outdamage newbies. Tho with PK-off, the newbies wouldn't have to worried about getting killed from players and it's much cheaper to get geared for MVP than PVP. It's true they wouldn't be able to stop geared players when they arrived but if the newbie arrived much earlier then at least they still get a chance to get the MVP drop Imagine a newbie almost killed Detale then a fully geared player appears, then they'd just have to kill the newbie and they get the drop. Geared players would always have the advantage since they're also likely experienced hunters. However turning PK-off would definitely help out newbies and reduce EoF monopoly but it would take out the fun of killing farmers and hunters I really don't care either since I farm, hunt, and pvp somewhere else hehehe :th_e2: A newbie almost killing Detale should just warp out and hide in a different place in the map once a geared player appears. I thought everyone had the common sense to do that. Well with TG, you get like 90% chance to get the card even if you arrive a bit late if you outdamage the newbie. What i tell my guildmates is that they call us when trying to hunt mvps like detale. So we never really had problems with this. And to tell you the truth, a newbie should not even care about detale because his drop is not needed for farming. When I hunted detale, i had decent gears and never had problems with people trying to steal the mvp because I can kill them. Geared players can monopolize the map more when PK is off since all they had to do is stay there and not worry about the others that might've the chance to kill them(example again is when i tell my guildmates to actually call us geared ones when they hunt if needed).
warrior911 Posted February 5, 2015 Report Posted February 5, 2015 A newbie almost killing Detale should just warp out and hide in a different place in the map once a geared player appears. I thought everyone had the common sense to do that. Imagine a newbie seeing Detale, the instinct would be to kill him asap not to calculate that he has damaged a lot and warp as soon as more geared player arrives. For an MVP that u barely see with rare drop, normally a newbie would be scared to experiment with stuff like that and couldn't Detale just heal himself if you warp? Even if that was your strategy, with the focus of killing Detale you would probably be killed before you can warp since you'd be geared for MVP to be able to deal decent damage before anyone comes. What i tell my guildmates is that they call us when trying to hunt mvps like detale. So we never really had problems with this. And to tell you the truth, a newbie should not even care about detale because his drop is not needed for farming. When I hunted detale, i had decent gears and never had problems with people trying to steal the mvp because I can kill them. This is usually what happens, only the MVP guilds get the drop because some of them are focused on killing hunters themselves and only few on Detale. This is what I mean by monopoly since they can set up the price knowing they have most if not all the drops. It's true newbies don't need his drop.My only argument was that turning PK off would increase the chance for newbies to get the drop and reduce EoF monopoly. As to whether or not newbies should be given more chance or MVP guilds should dominate and set the price, I have no opinion of since I don't know what effect this would have on the market Geared players can monopolize the map more when PK is off since all they had to do is stay there and not worry about the others that might've the chance to kill them(example again is when i tell my guildmates to actually call us geared ones when they hunt if needed). I'm not sure what this means, there are tons of mobs in abyss_03 you can't just sit there and chill haha. Also I think newbies should be more worried about getting killed rather than the geared ones, so again turning PK-off would favor newbies. Newbies can stay there too and even farm while not having to worry of getting killed
GenericName Posted February 6, 2015 Report Posted February 6, 2015 I'm sorry to be blunt, but this is a PK server. If you're undergeared and don't like to be killed while farming, you shouldn't be playing on a PK server.
Rayray Posted February 7, 2015 Report Posted February 7, 2015 Imagine a newbie seeing Detale, the instinct would be to kill him asap not to calculate that he has damaged a lot and warp as soon as more geared player arrives. For an MVP that u barely see with rare drop, normally a newbie would be scared to experiment with stuff like that and couldn't Detale just heal himself if you warp? Even if that was your strategy, with the focus of killing Detale you would probably be killed before you can warp since you'd be geared for MVP to be able to deal decent damage before anyone comes. This is usually what happens, only the MVP guilds get the drop because some of them are focused on killing hunters themselves and only few on Detale. This is what I mean by monopoly since they can set up the price knowing they have most if not all the drops. It's true newbies don't need his drop.My only argument was that turning PK off would increase the chance for newbies to get the drop and reduce EoF monopoly. As to whether or not newbies should be given more chance or MVP guilds should dominate and set the price, I have no opinion of since I don't know what effect this would have on the market I'm not sure what this means, there are tons of mobs in abyss_03 you can't just sit there and chill haha. Also I think newbies should be more worried about getting killed rather than the geared ones, so again turning PK-off would favor newbies. Newbies can stay there too and even farm while not having to worry of getting killed Again, a newbie should not be hunting Detale if he can't defend himself. Most MVP hunters instinct is to warp out if someone comes in, granted he dealt the most damage already. An MVP guild can take monopoly as well with PK off, and with PK off, there is no way for others to actually stop them on getting the monopoly. My biochemist can literally chill in abyss_03, the mobs there are really not that strong for a geared player.
plok123 Posted February 7, 2015 Author Report Posted February 7, 2015 The map spawns an mvp, which has a drop that is pretty pricey. Geared/newbies can kill the mvp, it's not about the geared outdamaging the newbie, you can get the mvp as long as you land the first hit with enough damage, you dont even need to be fully geared to get detale. The problem im pointing out here is the idiots that kill the ungeared ones. even if you;re geared, you're not geared to fight other players, your geared to kill an mvp. turning pk off in this map would make the mvp hunting experience better. IMO. If you wanna go kill players, go to the map where everyone is equally geared as you and is looking for the same thing, not in a place where no one wants fight anyone :)
Sketchy Angel Posted February 7, 2015 Report Posted February 7, 2015 Again, as previously stated: "This is a PK server." 1
plok123 Posted February 7, 2015 Author Report Posted February 7, 2015 Again, as previously stated: "This is a PK server." Maybe why it's called a 'Suggestion' thread
sartorius19 Posted February 8, 2015 Report Posted February 8, 2015 The map spawns an mvp, which has a drop that is pretty pricey. Geared/newbies can kill the mvp, it's not about the geared outdamaging the newbie, you can get the mvp as long as you land the first hit with enough damage, you dont even need to be fully geared to get detale. The problem im pointing out here is the idiots that kill the ungeared ones. even if you;re geared, you're not geared to fight other players, your geared to kill an mvp. turning pk off in this map would make the mvp hunting experience better. IMO. If you wanna go kill players, go to the map where everyone is equally geared as you and is looking for the same thing, not in a place where no one wants fight anyone :) Yes the map indeed spawns an mvp which drops an expensive loot. But then again, that is the case of this map when the MVP topic is on. But this map is also used as a farming site which is a different case imo. My stand is that we should consider both points that u clearly stated on your suggestion: 1st - the map as a zeny farming site 2nd - the map as an mvp site The discussion is now focused on the MVP side only. So this suggestion is becoming one sided. If its the MvP side, i therefore suggest to have an exclusive loot chance to the one who get to hit the mvp 1st not considering damage output so long as you dont die before the mvp gets killed. So everyone would benefit. This resolves KS issues. Both geared or ungeared player would have a fair chance and now will based on the luck and timing. Pk off wouldnt be ideal for both points. but with these. its not much change on the map solely. but for the benefit of all hunted MVPs
warrior911 Posted February 8, 2015 Report Posted February 8, 2015 Again, a newbie should not be hunting Detale if he can't defend himself. Most MVP hunters instinct is to warp out if someone comes in, granted he dealt the most damage already. An MVP guild can take monopoly as well with PK off, and with PK off, there is no way for others to actually stop them on getting the monopoly. My biochemist can literally chill in abyss_03, the mobs there are really not that strong for a geared player. With PK on, you could be killed before you could warp or even see that anyone else is there. If PK was off, solo hunters would almost always get the drop if they arrive first. Thus there would be more solo hunters (newbies not necessarily ungeared but likely no friends in the server yet) and more chances for others therefore no monopoly. As it is right now, only MVP groups are getting the drop which explains the increasing price of EoF. Again, my only argument is that PK-off would favor newbies/solo hunters I have mixed feelings about this since turning it off would take out the thrill of being in MVP group. Detale has the best MVP drop you can hunt as a group in this server. It would be like a game of hide and seek if PK was off and you wouldn't have to rely from friends to kill off the other competition. On the other side if you are new to the server, it would be difficult to join good MVP groups since they're usually full and they want to hoard then increase its price. lol
nate1002 Posted February 8, 2015 Report Posted February 8, 2015 (edited) I'm sorry to be blunt, but this is a PK server. If you're undergeared and don't like to be killed while farming, you shouldn't be playing on a PK server. Again, as previously stated: "This is a PK server." Firstly i would like to call out the idiots. All players knew perfectly well this is a PK server, and we play this best high rate server because players like to pvp and to be in this server. And this is discussed in a post for a specific reason. Please read what people type and think deeper with your head, then comment with a more specific and solid reason and make this constructive. (For example, you can simply say you enjoy killing under geared player in abyss_03 but dislike getting PVP token in a real pvp environment. Turning of PK ruined your fun.) Now, i can go back and comment: As Rayray and Sartorius19 already covered most points, i am just gonna restate things i agreed on. In the situation of Farming zeny, PK off in abyss_03 can let more under geared players with enough damage to farm there for the boxes and it surely will let new player get more zeny. For gearing purpose, right now detale has no key gear drops so players hunt him for quest items. If you are new and try to get gears u should hunt Ktullanux first then all other mvps or just simply camp at the mvp room NOT hunting detale... (if you want detale card, just broadcast and buy them for cheap, there will be players happily sell them to you) For quest purpose, just think of the 9realm quest items. Certain things harder to hunt because they may meant to be "rare" in the server. For fair chances of getting detale loot, sart19 had a pretty good suggestion (plus some mmo uses that feature too). Or read what rayray said, because i do the similar thing with my guildmates to secure drops from mvp. So in the light of "more zeny for newbie", I would say +1 to turn off PK in abyss_03 but i don't think this can help new players with the detale since the loot will belongs to player with more damage output. Plus, it will only be a short term fixed, since there seems to be a growing number of players but not growing places for farming even though mobs are instant spawn, there are limits for player per maps. If i think of the longer term changes, I would think there could be another custom map for zeny faming purpose (BUT not as high zeny per hour as abyss_03 unless players learn to group up and farm), then we can leave the abyss_03 as they were now. I can foresee people will talk about seed and berry farming, but well you sell them to players, not npc. Edited February 8, 2015 by nate1002
Rayray Posted February 8, 2015 Report Posted February 8, 2015 The map spawns an mvp, which has a drop that is pretty pricey. Geared/newbies can kill the mvp, it's not about the geared outdamaging the newbie, you can get the mvp as long as you land the first hit with enough damage, you dont even need to be fully geared to get detale. The problem im pointing out here is the idiots that kill the ungeared ones. even if you;re geared, you're not geared to fight other players, your geared to kill an mvp. turning pk off in this map would make the mvp hunting experience better. IMO. If you wanna go kill players, go to the map where everyone is equally geared as you and is looking for the same thing, not in a place where no one wants fight anyone :) Turning PK off will give the MVP guilds a higher chance to gain monopoly since they wouldn't get killed, they can just camp in there. Turning it off will not help newbies since there is absolutely no neccessity for them to actually kill Detale. Solo player or not, an MVP guild there will get it anyway, even if pk is off or on so this suggestion is not gonna help anybody.
