HealHard

I dont really understand discussion here. Noone makes new elite boxes anymore. Its price is low and it takes alot of effort to make one. Even new players can farm seeds and sell them to get this set in two hours and will have some tokens left even. Yes, MVPing is not for newbies. And i see no actual reason why it should be that way. Boosting MVP's hp doesnt make it challenging to kill it. Instead it becomes boring, repetitive and just wastes nerves or the player (as well as his time). I believe that MVPing is about skill. On official servers boss can just 1 hit you and people kill them with reflect for instance. There is a priest that resurrects the paladin who reflect damage done by boss to itself. Several minutes and MVP kills himself. Great job! and teamwork also. So i agree with nerfing MVPs anyway but the reason is not about the new players =)

Well, we have redux and reflect wings... Lets do some +%hp and +%atk/matk. seems like a good idea since redux are overpowered atm. this could balance it out. And also i am against any fset replacements.

leave your offers here.

Agreed. When you are damage-locked by creator for instance Paladin cant do anything really. Boosting Rapid Smiting by like 50% will help a little to balance out incoming/dealt damage.

This sounds good! Agreed to that one!

Disagree. Most people spent tokens on extra belts so if this is made they will become too cheap as too many extra belts appear on market. That would hurt economy.

What you guys suggest is to make a Sniper Bow wearable for clowns. And btw, Sniper will deal more damage anyway and they have strip also. I have no more will to argue about pvp, redux and this bow as i told everything before. And everyone seems to have skipped that part, as you all talk about the same things i told before. But apart from that, making a Sniper out of Clown is just the worst idea ever - this limits originality of ro classes and makes them all look like each other. Even stalkers DS nowadays. But they can copy some other skill to match DS. And clowns will just DS. Hell no. Either bow just keeps as it is (w/o autotarot on taking damage however) or it should be replaced directly with a ClownSoaringGuitar. P.s. Yes, i have a bow. But i dont even use it in duels unless i am ganged or really annoyed with someone. But i also have two other classes (sinx and champ) and i duel with bow users as well. If you think i will be smashed by bow nerf you are wrong. Its just my point of view on your suggestion.

If you see someone to die 5 times in a row from the same reason, he is not a good player. But as i already mentioned MANY times before, i suggest to leave autotarot on attack ONLY, so the situation discribed should not happen. By the way its quite annoying that you ignore the things i try to tell you, xtopher, and just spam messages with no arguments. In my previous posts i told about such situations with autotarot on hit. Please, read carefully. And you say that people you have listed are versus the bow. I see no posts from them. And yes, their respective opinion without posts here means that they are neutral on topic. Moreover, i doubt that you even had the right to say that with reference to them.

You say reductions. What are those? The shield and Probably the santa hat. 15% extra reductions more then just a shield. And almost the same thing as sacreds, so i dont get why you think that clowns have so nice reductions and dont have to worry about incoming damage. Once again about FCP and GTB: you always need FCP and GTB costs like 15 tokens. I see no obstacles to use those. I doubt that you can tank everyone with one set of gear. Even stalkers can hardly do that. Once again, if you wear GTB and if you are FCPed you just need to press Ygg button in time to last as long as you need to. And your remark about buffs is hilarious: one of the tarot cards removes all the buffs from the target. I bet you knew that :smile: . So non selfbuffs are kinda useless vs clown as you cant get em ASAP after dispell. Finally, if you think that its too much to have FCP and GTB at once vs Clown to be defended, then think of Champ. You need to wear 2xRay + sacreds/santahat + GR/tao + usakoshield to survive full asura and avoid using Devs (which is almost equal to death vs pro champ that starts to TSS you right away with converter). But noone complains about that, right? Indeed, its too late. So if clowns get a bow it should not be useless. And the one you suggest is worse then a common elite guitar, cus it has no jupitel and burst 4xAV damage with guitar beats 20% dmg boost with bows. Moreover, you cant use songs with the bow (like slowgrace/frost joker etc..), as i already mentioned before. 10% hp boost doesnt make any sense, as original HP of clown is too low. 5-10% chance of tarot on attack means that the bow tarot spam is far worse then manual one. I will keep my opinion as i see no actual arguments versus it. It seems that you just ignore some facts.

Sry for reviving quite old theme but i have smth different to suggest. Pvp place 1 gets wings and glory. But to get number1 you need gang and very good gears. Its impossible to get ladder 1st prize alone. However number two or three is quite possible. Maybe aside from boxes perishable suggested, give smth like 2PVPtoken for 2nd place and 1PVPtoken for 3rd place. And then make NPC to claim some special rucks for like 10 of those tokens. Or maybe sacreds of some special color for 30 of those? This will activate people to struggle in pvp even if there is a 10 ppl party. 2nd/3rd place prizes wont need the kill/death ratio and tokens/items should not be tradable. So it wont hurt economics but will allow people to have sacreds and rucks from pvp. I guess this thought will be unpopular, however id be glad if this system was implemented.

The general idea is to create some PvP ranking system in 1 vs 1 duels within the same player classes. First, people sign-up for the tournament on forum, leaving IGN of the character he wants to use. Topics to register are divided for different classes. Players are divided randomly into groups. The event itself should be hosted by several GMs who takes one group of the tournament so that event will flow faster. Each GM just warps the players from the group he leads to the pvp location so other people wont be able to spoil the duel. After group part, olympic system can be used to determine who is the best. Different classes should have tournaments on different days so multiclass users can show their skills. Winners can get some prizes and be marked as winners on the forums. Players should be given FCP once before start and use their own usable items. Storage disabled. IDK if all classes should be supported for this (Paladin vs Paladin is really... wierd). Its for Pvp - orientated classes like Sinx Champ Clown and so on. I know that this event will be hard to host, but if its only once a month or two? The tournament day should be marked beforehand so people can plan their business in order to take part in the event. Time barrier can be solved if its hosted on weekends when everyone can stay on at night even.

Give us the formula for final CT damage and lets simply count DPS with pro player spam rate (lets ask Juan to test. Hes one of the best spammers around). It should be kept at reasonable values. Its just my personal opinion that if it does more dmg then FAS then WS spam will become unyggable.

Ok it seems that i should go more in-depth. So, lets start with the abusive build : sacreds + santap hat. It means that clown has 2 slots left for Mayap and Fsold (and freezable also, try garm card in armor). This means that player must switch headgears in order to spam AVs. You just GTB while bow strikes and then Usako when different HG appears. If clown begins to DS and autotarot wont work when you hit clown that means he just gets some damage boost(cus you wear gtb or you can even switch usako while clown spams?). Thats what people wanted, right? Less defensive(and not so abusive) build: Santap OR sacreds on. Try to use stone curse armor. If that fails, clown has to switch headgears to spam AVs. Same situation with Kobold hat. Switch as fast as clown does to win. Use GTB until clown is stoned or switches HGs. If he SCs then do ur best burst damage and usako right after. If he switches, you switch to usako. Offensive build: 3kiels + fsold in headgears. No extra redux means vulnerability, but it allows fast switch to guitar. When you are getting hit with bow cloak/hide and uncloak right away. This means that ctrl-attack stops. and you have some extra time to hit. At this point autotarot when bow user is hit MUST be removed. When clown fails to reclick on you he shouldnt be able to randomly kill you with frigg reflect+comatarot. If the clown switches to guitars, use normal tactics vs him. If the clown doesnt have thana defaulting cloak with noxiouses is a good idea. Start with skolls. if u see that he tries to thana you, keep them on. Otherwise put noxiouses. Yes. You must learn to switch fast and probably use battlemode to do so. And yes, you must be attentive and know the game well to understand what to wear during battle. And yes, you should have proper gears. If you dont have gears, do not complain. Imagine if you have no skolls and you get thanaraped. It doesnt mean that thana must be nerfed, right? Any objections? just leave autotarot on attack only.

It seems to me that i am arguing with stalker players here, right? then its ok that you want to be OP when even tarot wont be able to kill you (and dispell your skill also). And what about really pro LKs now? i can go gears that i mentioned before and dont need gtb even. LK is completely useless now if you know how to counter. Before nerf they could do some damage at least. You guys are just mad when someone kills you with bow. You say it shows no skill. Ok. Does stalker show any real skill? or Sinx? or LK? maybe asura priest does? Most players use 1-2 skills and autoattack for their class as primary (i dont mention buffs of any kind). Recent posts show that players are just pissed cus "noobs" kill them with bow easily. I dont like that too, but i just GTB and show my own skill dueling The Bow, ygging the best way i can and freezing/stoning/full damaging/Wsing/stripping the enemy. Or you can avoid the bow user if you cant oppose him. Moreover, good players dont abuse the bow powers. If some player does, just gang him. Its easy to see when person is skilled and just using bow to force you gtb to av and who depends on coma only. if he forces GTB then be ready to ygg in like 0.5 seconds after then switch to full danage as there is pause between 2 series of AV spams. if you cant kill during that period, switch to usako. bad player will think like 10 seconds before tries to tarot you once again. and if he was just Autotatoting get autopneuma accessory for instance. Dont blame the bow. Maybe just ur strategy imperfect? Summing up all my thoughts. Nerf it to attack only autocast.

Da best pvp song ever :happy: Edited: and yes to suggestion ofcourse)

I say that you can spam CT ALOT faster then FAS cus u need no kiels for that even. Thats why damage should be reasonable. i took FAS just to compare, cus i believe its damage with new bow is really balanced out.

No advantage like 30% autotarot can replace 50% redux from shield and no chance to counter magic with GTB. Considering stalker SB: it doesn't kill. but it made you almost invulnerable. And with Frigg it would be 100% right? (25%(frigg)+30%(usako)+20%(bow)+10%(sacreds) +15%(santap. hat)) thats why its nerfed. About LKH: it is nerfed and good for nothing now. Noone plays LK anymore. Is that good? I dont think so. Ppl were just to lazy (dumb?) to use redux+noxious+angeling+Puppetring+gtb+Elemental protect potion. Anti spiral -.- i did use that and had no goddamn problems with coma or OP Spiral damage. And yes. I duel Clowns/gypsies who use bow with sinx (i have crit sword) and champ(dorcus). and i have no problems, really. bow is VERY predictable. I see no reasons to nerf it anyway.

You should make proper calculations then. i can agree on 2 and 3 but i suppose increasing all those things at once means very OP CT. Please, leave here some formulas so we can see the total damage from the skill. It should be less damage then FAS cus its aspd based.

8-10k spam is survivable. And Clown/gypsy forces you to go GTB even if they have no bow. so thats not OP. And no, people did not want to boost DS. DS is too easy to survive unlike AV. So AV > DS anyway. I suppose ppl wanted to nerf AV cus its very powerful with tarot. And we did get this. DS < AV and coma is a bit stronger with the bow. And again. 25% damage reduction on WOE means you can default GTB. also, if you have smth like friggs/stalker bow/sacreds its even more easy. Just default GTB and switch to usako if you sence asuras near. and then switch back. If you are breaking and dual wield - it means that you are ready to risk to get the castle. asura gonna kill you as well. And about 2h... Then make all the new bows 2h and useless once again. And yeah, Supream. I forgot to say that but you did get me. Leaving the tarot on attack only will be ok.

All the people who complain about the bow should remember that the bow has far more drawbacks then u mention. 1. While wearing a bow u cant use great deal of skills which limits strategy alot. No other class did recieve such "bonus" with new weaps 2. If opponent wears GTB and redux he has nothing much to worry. Most of people just ctrl-click. Can't you handle this? 3. Bow doesnt have Jupitel which means Pneuma saves from the bow despite the fact coma occures. 4. About "side" tarot effects: FCP is always a must in pvp. Everyone can WS or strip you. Its not just tarot. 5. 30% autocast is about what you get when you spam tarot manually with enough kiels. If we remove the tarot on attack then this would happen: the bow user is almost useless vs people who spam Asuras,FAS,AV and so on. They hit you rarely and do great damage which means tarot almost never triggers. And you wait for death with not so great damage as other classes. And about woe defence strategy: it changed now, so what? get your own bow and coma defenders! or attackers. and if ppl start default gtb Asura them! whats so bad about it? castles keep breaking despite the fact that the bow was released a long time ago. Get devo and dont fear coma. So, leave this bow alone.

Welcome, Danielle. I hope you won't be disappointed by FRo :-)

@xonchu: If get pawned with all those gears and bow by asuras etc. it means that you miss some gaming skill maybe? Other classes are able to stand agains those without that many reducts. And maxlittle007 is right, . Imagine times when thana worked on champs normally and then it was replaced with 28% damage effect. And this seems fair now, right? But champs were sooooooo nerfed! Imagine if you had ultimate killing machine that became 100500 times less powerfull! but this is fair. same with the bow. It didnt pass the in-game test, so it should be changed.

Dont mix up you and economy. That would hurt You if you bought the weap. And nothing changes to ones who did not. All the new weapons cost 1.3- 1.5k dq so after nerf i dont think it becomes much cheaper. However it would be just unfair, cus the donation system works like shop, so i would be pretty pissed if the bow became much worse then it was when i bought it. But if the community itself findes a compromise between both users of this weap and non-users, that will be fine. This topic shows that the compromise was found. And items stats are always subject to change. If some minority does not agree, then its too bad for them. Moreover, they wont nerf bow to useless. It will become just fair. Isnt that a good investment? So, remove the reducts and its gonna be fine =)

Well, lets think of of price then. most of people agree it to be smth like 10dq. Now imagine: people who have +10 gears want to de-refine those and pay 10 dq. Those 10dq are gone from the game. Who have +10 gears? Starters, who dont have many dq. Pros also have +10 gears but they need those to be +10 due to effectivness reasons, so they wont do de-refine. And starters are the most economically active elements of the Fro society. And they will throw away 10dq that could be used to buy something from other players. Thats pain, I'll explain why. The problem of Fro economics is not in overpricing or smth else. The real problem is that average player does not have dq. He may have gears, seeds, tickets... whatever. Because they buy smth they need when they have enough dq. All pure dqs are concentrated in the oldschool players' storages. They dont need anything more. They just save up. Its not their fault. Its the problem of server actually - Most rich players are not involved into economics deeply. New players dont have what rich guys need. They cant get the DQs out of them. You can say: speeds, yggs... right. but think of this: how many tix they need? Alot. But when they sell 1 emp they got extra - pff, and their dq + some more is back to pockets. They earn more then spend usually. In good old days economics was healthy because of the value of Elite weapons and sets. This was enough to connect lazy rich guys and new active players. 100dq for weapon and 40 dq for set - Awesome for starter! and now its 10dq set and 20-40 dq weapon. It became pointless. Thats why i am waiting of the new update. I hope it brings more opportunities to new players, so that blood of the server will circulate normally again. And now back to topic. 10 dq for de-refine? please save those. Make +10 and +0 gears equal. thats fair. 1 mil please. P.S. sorry, long reading. And dont blame me for off-topic please. just had to put these thoughts somewhere :crying_anim02:

oh yes! and i have even better idea: make the npc do it for like 1 mil fee. since farmor is still farmor, it would give more flexibility for people to gear up. Both +10 and +0 items are needed and i think its pretty pointless to value +0 things more then +10 ones (thana does more dmg on +10... blah-blah-blah... use Skolls and you are fine lol, otherwise ur +0 wont save ur ass).