ChainBreak Posted August 16, 2013 Report Posted August 16, 2013 Well SinX has many builds. I just haven't tried out SBK build a lot yet.
Shadi Posted August 31, 2013 Author Report Posted August 31, 2013 Seems like nobody is actually disagreeing with this anymore. Hope it'll be looked into soon :)
Shadi Posted October 29, 2013 Author Report Posted October 29, 2013 Bumping this up to possible get more people supporting it or disagreeing with it :)
ChainBreak Posted October 29, 2013 Report Posted October 29, 2013 Cast delay redux and sbk and meteor dmg should be added on lokis I think. (More dmg for sbk & meteor) Since meteor assault is a sinx only way to hit ninjas on cicada and flip tatami it would be nice to see more dmg on the skill so it can actually be used to kill.
Kayla Minerre Posted October 29, 2013 Report Posted October 29, 2013 Agreed. Maybe I'll actually get some use out of my lokis :D
Norse_Joog Posted October 30, 2013 Report Posted October 30, 2013 I played Soul breaker sinx before. I tried in Inca type and it never reach 50k to full geared players it only ranges like 9k-20k and yes, it can only rich 50k when using thana vs non skoll user and to those who doesn't have gears so boosting up a little in this by cast delays -10% will never be OP I think.
nilo16 Posted October 31, 2013 Report Posted October 31, 2013 Sbk spam maybe to much cause its to hard to catch up once u combine it with backslide, I think if u gonna spam sbk then u would have to balance out backslide spam. So ppl actually stand a chance to get close. Its not fun when u get kited plus spam locked.
nilo16 Posted October 31, 2013 Report Posted October 31, 2013 Say like 2 sec timer after using sbk spam before u can backslide. Cause sbk can cause status effects, dispel, break armours etc.. Unlike tomahawk And if they can slow kite forever trades would be too hard cause sbk is range .. It would be to hard if there were no way to get close. Im.not a sinx expect So pls don't flame me im all for new ways of playing .. Just shared my thoughts on what I've experienced .
Kayla Minerre Posted October 31, 2013 Report Posted October 31, 2013 Sbk spam maybe to much cause its to hard to catch up once u combine it with backslide, I think if u gonna spam sbk then u would have to balance out backslide spam. So ppl actually stand a chance to get close. Its not fun when u get kited plus spam locked. That's what the sinx card is for. So you can cloak and not be hit by ranged attacks. Say like 2 sec timer after using sbk spam before u can backslide. Cause sbk can cause status effects, dispel, break armours etc.. Unlike tomahawk And if they can slow kite forever trades would be too hard cause sbk is range .. It would be to hard if there were no way to get close. Im.not a sinx expect So pls don't flame me im all for new ways of playing .. Just shared my thoughts on what I've experienced . So can any other ranged attack from any other class. Anyway, the point isn't to make it comparable to other classes and add a ranged ability, it's to actually make the ranged ability it already has a viable option. Besides, you can easily protect against most status effects that sbk can cause. Dispell, wear gtb. Break armor, use FCP. Etc... Besides, the whole point of having a long ranged attack is to keep the enemies away from you. Snipers have Arrow Repel, Clowns/Gypsy have Jupitel Thunder now, Stalkers have backslide and a ranged attack that they can use with their normal builds. Anyway, if you did this for backslide, it'd have to be done like what they did with snap, which would make backslide useless.
nilo16 Posted October 31, 2013 Report Posted October 31, 2013 Yes stalkers can backslide and use range attack. but is it on 100% spam... Ok magic can be counted by gtb but sb can't Not to mention ranged classes do not have the hp/surviablity of a assassin So they need to kite being really squshy , even then ppl use rsx to counter push back but with backslide u can't counter it at all.. So it will be a huge hp pool with amazing evasion..and we can't get in range Its not that I don't want sbk spam.i just want it tested for this scenario. Cloaking for ranged attacks ..ok that's why ppl have Maya purple / bix of sunlight purplenot to mention sinx Doesn't even need to switch out cards to cloak it keeps the surviablity intact even in cloak..
nilo16 Posted October 31, 2013 Report Posted October 31, 2013 (edited) The way I see it is SB sinx play like wizards meaning they have very similar stats. Rest of the Ranged will have to stack a lot more dex for any good damage. So what we will essentially create is a wiz with huge hp pool, damage that passes through Gtb, and who can kite u for ages with Backslide. at least Maya reflects wizard single target JT spam.. and RSX makes u stand ur ground. Edited October 31, 2013 by nilo16
Kayla Minerre Posted October 31, 2013 Report Posted October 31, 2013 (edited) The way I see it is SB sinx play like wizards meaning they have very similar stats. Rest of the Ranged will have to stack a lot more dex for any good damage. So what we will essentially create is a wiz with huge hp pool, damage that passes through Gtb, and who can kite u for ages with Backslide. at least Maya reflects wizard single target JT spam.. and RSX makes u stand ur ground. What you actually create is a professor that can only use Stave Crasher, but without the redux of Energy Coat. Now, you have to remember that sbk sinx can't have the same str that regular sinx do. They'll have a very limited supply of seeds, which is even more limited by the fact that none of their weapons gives them the weight limit skill, unlike every other ranged/magic class. You also have the fact that, outside of magnum break (which is easily nerfed by RSX), all you'd have to do is pnuema and they'd be useless. No amount of backsliding is going to save them from pneuma. Obviously, some classes are gonna have a hard time with this build of sinx, but there are plenty of counters against it out there. While we're on the topic of it, you'll also have to remember that, since they'll have to focus their stats like a caster, they'll have to choose between more seeds or more hp, something that every other class doesn't have to do. So, take a look at it that way. If they take the "huge hp pool" that you say they'll have, they'll be able to carry like, 200 seeds max. You also have to remember that SBK, on this server, does very low damage as it is (see above). If they want to actually do damage, they'll have to go two weapons and forsake their shield, which would leave them open to high damage, which they wouldn't be able to tank. And envenom counter is pretty much useless without str. Edited October 31, 2013 by Kayla Minerre
nilo16 Posted October 31, 2013 Report Posted October 31, 2013 Pneuma is a ranged counter yes but u can't be killed using pneuma as u can use pnuema too I still can't reach u .. Cause u backslude away I don't think 30k spamable damage is less at all.. Btw sb has a str component also so u can dfinately get more str and still boost damage its not like stave crasher .. Its a hybrid magic that can't be reflected or mitigated via gtb. Assasiibs also get better str bonuses with job lvls So u will definitely have lot of seeds...and a ton of hp and be very hard to target for any melee class.. And u will easily outlive mage class wuth just gtb/maya I don't see any real counter classes. And to note SB is attack that u can change element with ease There is no other magic spell like that the damage potential is huge And counter way lower not all range have enlarged weight eg: gunslinger
nilo16 Posted October 31, 2013 Report Posted October 31, 2013 My only worry is how do u reach a sbk spamming sinx with backslide.. Even if u reach one can u do enough to kill him cause of his hp plus its super easy to get Sheild on just for 2 sec of melee before u backslide Sheild. Kiting for the duration of fcp won't be hard at all.. Then ..sb can break strip armours doing good damage..
Kayla Minerre Posted October 31, 2013 Report Posted October 31, 2013 My only worry is how do u reach a sbk spamming sinx with backslide.. Even if u reach one can u do enough to kill him cause of his hp plus its super easy to get Sheild on just for 2 sec of melee before u backslide Sheild. Kiting for the duration of fcp won't be hard at all.. Then ..sb can break strip armours doing good damage.. Again, all of this can be blocked. It's not that hard to kill a sinx, even one that backslides a lot with ranged attacks, on many classes. They aren't all-powerful. Either way, all I see is a bunch of worrying for a class build that doesn't do a lot of damage, and damage that can easily be reduced by several card and gear combinations. I'll end this with this: It's a ranged skill. Sinx using SBK will need to be at a range to be effective. if they cannot use the skills that they have to get them to that range as they need, then there isn't any point of setting up the build for it. Nerfing backslide would be like nerfing Snapr for champs, as I said earlier. It's not something you do simply because it gives them an advantage. If a sinx backslides and SBKs you, then counter it with pneuma and make them come to you.
nilo16 Posted October 31, 2013 Report Posted October 31, 2013 Okie.. Kool if u say its counterable. I don't mind if would only be horrible if they can easy kite u And kill I guess with testing it will be balanced damage to Evasion and should give us all a new way to play :D
Rayray Posted October 31, 2013 Report Posted October 31, 2013 SBK wouldn't even reach high damage without dual weapons and/or thana, and can be blocked by pneuma as well.
Shadi Posted October 31, 2013 Author Report Posted October 31, 2013 (edited) Nice to see some discussion going on here. I'll elaborate some things for the ones that worry about this. Sbk spam maybe to much cause its to hard to catch up once u combine it with backslide,[/size] I think if u gonna spam sbk then u would have to balance out backslide spam. So ppl actually stand a chance to get close.[/size] Its not fun when u get kited plus spam locked. [/size] Firstly, to take your worries away, SBK (even with 100% reduction on cd) can not stunlock like acid demonstration or spiral pierce can. It's only a single hit, not multiple hits so you will not stagger as much by SBK spam as you do to AV/AD/Spiral. Secondly, the damage they will be doing is utterly low compared to other classes. It'll do about 1/3 max of FAS damage but then it'll be spammed faster. This means people will have more time to react and it'll be easier to ygg through.[/size] Say like 2 sec timer after using sbk spam before u can backslide. [/size] Cause sbk can cause status effects, dispel, break armours etc.. Unlike tomahawk[/size] And if they can slow kite forever trades would be too hard cause sbk is range ..[/size] It would be to hard if there were no way to get close.[/size] Im.not a sinx expect [/size] So pls don't flame me im all for new ways of playing ..[/size] Just shared my thoughts on what I've experienced . [/size] As for these concerns. First things first, setting such a delay on a character's escape ability is out of the question. Why would you go for a range build if your class no longer has a way to stay in range?[/size] Secondly, SBK can not cause status effects from cards. While throw tommahawk can cause status effects. You're turning things around here. Sinx will be able to kite like a stalker, only their damage and survivability will be a lot less. Stalkers can go ranged just by adding dex. By going dex they get attack speed (maximum), and damage. If SinX want to be effective at range they need STR for dmg, INT int for dmg, AGI for attack speed and DEX for hit. Therefore they will have little vit and thus won't be as "tanky" as people are trying to claim atm. Some additonal info on the skill: Being ranged, the skill is completely blocked by Pneuma. Enchant Deadly Poison does not affect Soul Breaker's damage in any way. +% Cards do not affect Soul Breaker's damage in any way. Status cards' effects do not carry. Ice Pick and Combat Knife affects only the physical part. Yes stalkers can backslide and use range attack. [/size] but is it on 100% spam... [/size] Double strafe spam will remain faster than 100% delay reduction soulbreaker. Specially due to it hitting twice.[/size] Not to mention ranged classes do not have the hp/surviablity of a assassin[/size] So they need to kite being really squshy , even then ppl use rsx to counter push back[/size] but with backslide u can't counter it at all..[/size] You're thinking about autoattack sinx/crit sinx. SBK sinx however won't be as tanky as explained above, they need multiple stats for their damage, not a single stat like melee sinx do. So sbk sinx will have a lot less vit compared to for example crit ones (crit doesn't need dex or int). As for the not being able to counter. Stalkers are very tanky classes in this server and they have a strong bow + can backslide. Does it make them OP? I believe not.[/size] The way I see it is SB sinx play like wizards [/size] meaning they have very similar stats. Rest of the [/size] Ranged will have to stack a lot more dex for any good damage.[/size] So what we will essentially create is a wiz with huge hp pool,[/size] damage that passes through Gtb, and who can kite u for ages with [/size] Backslide. [/size] at least Maya reflects wizard single target JT spam..[/size] and RSX makes u stand ur ground. [/size] Myself, as one of the only wiz players on this server simply do not agree/get this statement. No, builds will not be similar. Wizards don't need str for their magic to do damage, sinx however do need str with their magic skill. And as explained twice already, ranged sinx wont have a huge hp pool. Adding onto that SBK will never ever reach the damage from JT spam. JT spam is supposed to be so much higher because it's easy to block and even used against the caster. [/size] Cause u backslude away I don't think 30k spamable damage is less at all..[/size] 30k will never be reached unles the target wears no shield or unless it's thana on none skoll OR the sinx is full sbk build and uses 2 weapons as well. This'll leave them very squishy. (being able to be 1-2 hitted by pretty much everything).[/size] Assasiibs also get better str bonuses with job lvls[/size] These bonus stats do not help you carry more. Only your base stats do. [/size] And to note SB is attack that u can change element with ease[/size] There is no other magic spell like that the damage potential is huge[/size] And counter way lower[/size] Any magic class has a wide variety of elements to use. The damage potential ( the way it is right now, even with the increased spam rate) is low to moderate.[/size] Edited October 31, 2013 by Shadi
nilo16 Posted November 1, 2013 Report Posted November 1, 2013 Nice bring forth the sbk sinx :D Im not scared anymore . Oh btw is it true tomahawk can cause status effects.. I didn't know that.. So it can trigger valk card dispel? Or dragoon strip, Or meltdown ..
Shadi Posted November 1, 2013 Author Report Posted November 1, 2013 Nice bring forth the sbk sinx :D Im not scared anymore . Oh btw is it true tomahawk can cause status effects.. I didn't know that.. So it can trigger valk card dispel? Or dragoon strip, Or meltdown .. It can cause status effects yes, such as freeze, meltdown etc. However dispell and strip can't be caused by skills other than the original dispel and strip skills. In other words, you cant autocast a strip or dispell skill by using another skill such as throw tommahawk.
