Land Pro, Pneuma and Merchant Classes

[CarlyRae]

Let me begin by saying that I understand that this is a private server and the developers may do whatever they wish to do, however, I think a suggestion or two for the better will not hurt.

Having said that, I would like to express my concern about the ability of creators to use land pro, let alone level 3 land pro. While I understand that the purpose of this is to give creators the fair chance in pvp by allowing them to remove pneuma using land pro, I am against this idea and I would like to outline the reasons why.

First, by allowing creators to use land pro, they do not only get to remove pneuma, but they also gain invincibility from AOE skills of Wizards.

Second, this makes professors, arguably one of the most important classes in Ragnarok, pretty useless. Land Pro is their signature skill and by allowing creators to use land pro, you take away from them their role. Land pro is a very powerful skill, so powerful that nowhere in ragnarok will you find a gear nor a card that ENABLES the use of land pro. You only have the detale card whose chance of casting landpro is dependent on chance and not on the user's dictates.

Third, by allowing them the use of land pro, you do not maximize their full capability. Whatever happened to Cart Revolution? Last time I checked, it shoves the target away a few cells. 

Fourth, by giving them land pro, you make priests - sitting ducks. They are not meant to kill, all they have are defensive skills. And if u take away pneuma and safety wall, they become vulnerable sitting ducks spamming berry trying to survive. The land pro would not let them cast pneuma or safety wall again. 

I understand that this is the community's solution to the problem of creators and so as a compromise, I would like to propose that instead of land pro, give the creators ganbantein. It achieves the same purpose while addressing all of the other concerns above.

EDIT: Give them ganbantein and lower Erende Ebecee's chance of casting pneuma to a percentage that is acceptable to the community.

Feel free to say your opinions but ensure that you say it in a manner that is decent and courteous. 

 

View my other suggestions about Safety wall and Pneuma here   and about Snipers here

Edited February 26, 2018 by CarlyRae

[Ableton]

+1

I somehow agree.

[Specter]

On 2/15/2018 at 11:55 AM, CarlyRae said:

Feel free to say your opinions but ensure that you say it in a manner that is decent and courteous. 

After seeing your replies on the safety wall suggestion, this tickles me in the wrong way.

Either way, I agree with you on this one, LP on creator makes no sense to me. But napalm vulcan on whitesmiths too, among other things.

[CarlyRae]

2 hours ago, Specter said:

After seeing your replies on the safety wall suggestion, this tickles me in the wrong way.

That is a fair warning that if you try to insult me or my ideas, I'll embarrass you. He insulted my idea saying "My argument lacks... a lot" and so I replied the way I did and I did that only to him not the other ones.

[CarlyRae]

Bump

I just recently discovered that Whitesmiths are able to use the Pneuma Skill, hence I am posting again.

 

I am suggesting that they be stripped of that ability because a powerful damaging class such as Whitesmith shouldn't have a good damage output and at the same time be able to defend itself using a skill that is not originally a part of its skill tree. That is unfair to so many classes that will continuously receive massive damage but do no damage in return because of Pneuma.   

Secondly, Creators were given Land Pro because they need that to have a chance at winning (but again LP is not good because they get way more than what they need.) However, for WS I don't think they need Pneuma. They can win without it - they have decent damage, they destroy armors and weapons, and they can carry way more berries than most classes, and they can use Sinx Card that basically gives them the same defense benefits. There's really no point in giving them that skill. It just makes them OP. 

I have a lot more to say but I'll keep them for when the need arises.

I'm suggesting that they be prevented from using Pneuma, if not, give everyone 1000% resistance to whitesmiths so it's a fair game.

Regards~

BTW, I edited the title of this thread to reflect this new suggestion. 

[Brianology!]

9 hours ago, CarlyRae said:

Bump

I just recently discovered that Whitesmiths are able to use the Pneuma Skill, hence I am posting again.

 

I am suggesting that they be stripped of that ability because a powerful damaging class such as Whitesmith shouldn't have a good damage output and at the same time be able to defend itself using a skill that is not originally a part of its skill tree. That is unfair to so many classes that will continuously receive massive damage but do no damage in return because of Pneuma.   

Secondly, Creators were given Land Pro because they need that to have a chance at winning (but again LP is not good because they get way more than what they need.) However, for WS I don't think they need Pneuma. They can win without it - they have decent damage, they destroy armors and weapons, and they can carry way more berries than most classes, and they can use Sinx Card that basically gives them the same defense benefits. There's really no point in giving them that skill. It just makes them OP. 

I have a lot more to say but I'll keep them for when the need arises.

I'm suggesting that they be prevented from using Pneuma, if not, give everyone 1000% resistance to whitesmiths so it's a fair game.

Regards~

BTW, I edited the title of this thread to reflect this new suggestion. 

ws c got nerfed so I don't think anyone plays that anymore.. and ws b blows in 1v1 situations because of 1 ring or 1 card no need to remove pneuma xD to be honest ws b might be the worst 1v1 class in the whole server because you have to switch fast between 5-6 armors cloaks and even sometimes I get caught because im too slow. smart players and half decent players know the counter to ws so I won't say it since i play it. this is coming from the only ws b player I see ( so far ) so stop making dumb suggestions if u don't even play ws or pvp in general -____-

[maren]

are you even aware of the damage of the WS c?? is that all you want ? you want  your character to be OP ?? and besides its still how you use it. damage is not everything dude. and besides you have all your tools why still want more? unlike the real players who get tired unlike you rich people that use macro :D not a hater i just cant stand your point cause i dont even get your stop making DUMB SUGGESTIONS DUUUHH there's gm here that will approve and disapprove. not a hater of yours

[CarlyRae]

8 hours ago, Brianology! said:

ws c got nerfed so I don't think anyone plays that anymore.. and ws b blows in 1v1 situations because of 1 ring or 1 card no need to remove pneuma xD to be honest ws b might be the worst 1v1 class in the whole server because you have to switch fast between 5-6 armors cloaks and even sometimes I get caught because im too slow. smart players and half decent players know the counter to ws so I won't say it since i play it. this is coming from the only ws b player I see ( so far ) so stop making dumb suggestions if u don't even play ws or pvp in general -____-

The rule is simple: When you get something, you gotta lose something. What did you lose when you got that Pneuma skill? What did other classes gain to counter that skill? None. You can't be getting something without losing something in return. Were the other classes, or at least its overall impact in PVP, even taken into consideration when that skill was given to them? I'm not just talking about Snipers here. I'm talking about Champs, Clowns, Ranged Stalkers, Creators, Paladins, Assassin Crosses that will suffer because of this skill imbalance.

Giving them Pneuma is tantamount to making them OP because there are other alternatives to that such as the Sinx Card. You want immunity? Sure, you can have that, but you gotta lose one Skoll card or 1 Noxious Card or 1 Raydric Card or 1 Deviling card in exchange of not getting hit from afar. You can't be giving them Pneuma and have them not lose anything in return. The idea of giving them Pneuma is like saying sure, you can have all the resistance gears/cards that you want and on top of that you can defend yourself using this powerful skill. That's OP. That's unfair.

Again, The WS class doesn't need that skill. There are other alternatives to that such as the sinx Card that is more fair and balanced because when u receive its immunity, you are not able to attack as well else u get exposed. Unlike that Pneuma skill, you get immunity and at the same time be able to deal massive damage. That's unfair 

That will be all for now. 

Btw, just because you don't like my suggestion doesn't mean they're dumb. I'm letting your insult fly but I would like to put on record that you insulted me and called my suggestions "dumb".

Regards~

 

1 hour ago, maren said:

are you even aware of the damage of the WS c?? is that all you want ? you want  your character to be OP ?? and besides its still how you use it. damage is not everything dude. and besides you have all your tools why still want more? unlike the real players who get tired unlike you rich people that use macro :D not a hater i just cant stand your point cause i dont even get your stop making DUMB SUGGESTIONS DUUUHH there's gm here that will approve and disapprove. not a hater of yours

I think maren was referring to Brianology and not me.

Regards~

[Brianology!]

1 hour ago, maren said:

are you even aware of the damage of the WS c?? is that all you want ? you want  your character to be OP ?? and besides its still how you use it. damage is not everything dude. and besides you have all your tools why still want more? unlike the real players who get tired unlike you rich people that use macro :D not a hater i just cant stand your point cause i dont even get your stop making DUMB SUGGESTIONS DUUUHH there's gm here that will approve and disapprove. not a hater of yours

you talking about me? /wah i wont even respond to you you're not worth being in contact with me 

[Brianology!]

4 minutes ago, CarlyRae said:

The rule is simple: When you get something, you gotta lose something. What did you lose when you got that Pneuma skill? What did other classes gain to counter that skill? None. You can't be getting something without losing something in return. Were the other classes, or at least its overall impact in PVP, even taken into consideration when that skill was given to them? I'm not just talking about Snipers here. I'm talking about Champs, Clowns, Ranged Stalkers, Creators, Paladins, Assassin Crosses that will suffer because of this skill imbalance.

Giving them Pneuma is tantamount to making them OP because there are other alternatives to that such as the Sinx Card. You want immunity? Sure, you can have that, but you gotta lose one Skoll card or 1 Noxious Card or 1 Raydric Card or 1 Deviling card in exchange of not getting hit from afar. You can't be giving them Pneuma and have them not lose anything in return. The idea of giving them Pneuma is like saying sure, you can have all the resistance gears/cards that you want and on top of that you can defend yourself using this powerful skill. That's OP. That's unfair.

Again, The WS class doesn't need that skill. There are other alternatives to that such as the sinx Card that is more fair and balanced because when u receive its immunity, you are not able to attack as well else u get exposed. Unlike that Pneuma skill, you get immunity and at the same time be able to deal massive damage. That's unfair 

That will be all for now. 

Btw, just because you don't like my suggestion doesn't mean they're dumb. I'm letting your insult fly but I would like to put on record that you insulted me and called my suggestions "dumb".

Regards~

 

I think maren was referring to Brianology and not me.

Regards~

the idea of giving pneuma was that maybe ws was easily kitable by classes like sniper? trap spam fas or ds repeat what does ws do? XD put two players that are decent at pvp vs ws and on ws and you'll understand.. ws is weak as shit 1vs1.. idk stop trying to play victim i called your suggestion dumb not you theres a huge difference. but here's something you should realize... you cannot make suggestions like this if you rarely play pvp.. it doesn't make sense

[CarlyRae]

7 minutes ago, Brianology! said:

the idea of giving pneuma was that maybe ws was easily kitable by classes like sniper? trap spam fas or ds repeat what does ws do? XD put two players that are decent at pvp vs ws and on ws and you'll understand.. ws is weak as shit 1vs1.. idk stop trying to play victim i called your suggestion dumb not you theres a huge difference. but here's something you should realize... you cannot make suggestions like this if you rarely play pvp.. it doesn't make sense

Again, as I have said, there is the SinxCard that basically gives you the same immunity that Pneuma gives you. Someone asking that Pneuma be maintained as a WS skill is tantamount to  someone asking for a HUGE ADVANTAGE in PVP because there are readily available options to address that issue, hence Pneuma is no longer needed. Winning PVPs because you got a huge advantage is not sweet. 

You asking someone to stop making suggestions because you think they don't go to PVP is like saying Mark Zuckerberg shouldn't be a programmer because he never got a programming degree from any university. And if we follow your logic, then maybe we won't have airplanes today, because then the Wright Brothers wouldn't have pushed through with their desire to someday be able to fly because they were never pilots. 

Regards~

[maren]

yeah brianology think before you enter my motto for you dude. i think all you know is OP class so you aint playin other class cause its balance?? how ironic hahaha despite you having all tools its an advantage for you cause you don't get tired  unlike we normal players all our mucles is in our fingers :D PEACEEEEE not a hater i just can't stand it :)

 

 

Edited February 27, 2018 by maren

[maren]

and besides dude IS TOMAHAWK IS THE ONLY ATTACK FOR WS ?????

[Ableton]

11 hours ago, Brianology! said:

but here's something you should realize... you cannot make suggestions like this if you rarely play pvp.. it doesn't make sense

 

11 hours ago, CarlyRae said:

You asking someone to stop making suggestions because you think they don't go to PVP is like saying Mark Zuckerberg shouldn't be a programmer because he never got a programming degree from any university. And if we follow your logic, then maybe we won't have airplanes today, because then the Wright Brothers wouldn't have pushed through with their desire to someday be able to fly because they were never pilots.

Your suggestion may sound "good" in theory, but as brian implies, pvp-ing (alot) brings experiences and lessons that players would be able tell which is needed, which is not, which is op-ed, which is junk. Actual scenarios and testing would be the best way to come up with the conclusion. Even gm's try it on actual and test it several times just to finalize some changes or fixes. They don't just sit around, scratching their heads and just "think". We have to do both, think and put it to test.

I believe most of your examples are based on theory,  not on what's really happening in pvp room, fild, woe, gvg, br, etc.

Yes, you are "thinking". But you are also rejecting some of the inputs and facts laid out for you from "experienced" players here who knows what's happening around. Go out. See things for yourself.

Edited February 27, 2018 by Ableton

[Brianology!]

5 hours ago, Ableton said:

 

Your suggestion may sound "good" in theory, but as brian implies, pvp-ing (alot) brings experiences and lessons that players would be able tell which is needed, which is not, which is op-ed, which is junk. Actual scenarios and testing would be the best way to come up with the conclusion. Even gm's try it on actual and test it several times just to finalize some changes or fixes. They don't just sit around, scratching their heads and just "think". We have to do both, think and put it to test.

I believe most of your examples are based on theory,  not on what's really happening in pvp room, fild, woe, gvg, br, etc.

Yes, you are "thinking". But you are also rejecting some of the inputs and facts laid out for you from "experienced" players here who knows what's happening around. Go out. See things for yourself.

hes right ^^ he did the talking for me. you cant compare something like that to this because they are completely different even if the aspect is the same.. your analogy is also wrong lol you can't just make a suggestion something pvp related and never touch pvp at all. thats like saying you know how to prepare a dish but you havent even experienced any cooking lessons. it just doesn't make sense because you dont understand what really happens in pvp.. you just look at it from the outside in. also, stop comparing pneuma and cloak. they are very, very different. sinx rewards you with more with the loss of a card slot... isn't that how its supposed to work? 

 

16 hours ago, maren said:

yeah brianology think before you enter my motto for you dude. i think all you know is OP class so you aint playin other class cause its balance?? how ironic hahaha despite you having all tools its an advantage for you cause you don't get tired  unlike we normal players all our mucles is in our fingers :D PEACEEEEE not a hater i just can't stand it :)

 

 

and you... yikes i dont know what to say... i know you envy me and look up to me im your idol.. im your representation of a god towards you... you don't have to come into contact with me by starting an argument with me with your broken english. just message me my guy

 

12 hours ago, maren said:

and besides dude IS TOMAHAWK IS THE ONLY ATTACK FOR WS ?????

no its not obviously... i have never touched tomahawk in my life.. thats probably why you think im playing only "op" classes and my fingers never get "tired". i do use my finger im just naturally more talented than you in everything so i can spam 999x fast as you.. theres a reason why i have 99999999 wpm

[CarlyRae]

6 hours ago, Ableton said:

Your suggestion may sound "good" in theory, but as brian implies, pvp-ing (alot) brings experiences and lessons that players would be able tell which is needed, which is not, which is op-ed, which is junk. Actual scenarios and testing would be the best way to come up with the conclusion. Even gm's try it on actual and test it several times just to finalize some changes or fixes. They don't just sit around, scratching their heads and just "think". We have to do both, think and put it to test.

I believe most of your examples are based on theory,  not on what's really happening in pvp room, fild, woe, gvg, br, etc.

Yes, you are "thinking". But you are also rejecting some of the inputs and facts laid out for you from "experienced" players here who knows what's happening around. Go out. See things for yourself.

How am I rejecting the inputs? Can you please point out exactly what I said that rejected the inputs from other players? I am merely suggesting but that doesn't necessarily mean I am rejecting inputs. Let me clarify: Us, having different opinions is not equal to rejecting inputs. We are here to discuss things to come up with the best solution. 

As you have said, the GMs can test whatever we say here so what's the big fuss about me giving my ideas and suggesting? I am here giving my ideas, and the GMs may test it and decide whether to implement them or not.

Everyone has the liberty to suggest, and nobody can take that liberty away from them. 

 

Anyway, let me reiterate what I said:

18 hours ago, CarlyRae said:

The rule is simple: When you get something, you gotta lose something. What did you lose when you got that Pneuma skill? What did other classes gain to counter that skill? None. You can't be getting something without losing something in return. Were the other classes, or at least its overall impact in PVP, even taken into consideration when that skill was given to them? I'm not just talking about Snipers here. I'm talking about Champs, Clowns, Ranged Stalkers, Creators, Paladins, Assassin Crosses that will suffer because of this skill imbalance.

Giving them Pneuma is tantamount to making them OP because there are other alternatives to that such as the Sinx Card. You want immunity? Sure, you can have that, but you gotta lose one Skoll card or 1 Noxious Card or 1 Raydric Card or 1 Deviling card in exchange of not getting hit from afar. You can't be giving them Pneuma and have them not lose anything in return. The idea of giving them Pneuma is like saying sure, you can have all the resistance gears/cards that you want and on top of that you can defend yourself using this powerful skill. That's OP. That's unfair.

Again, The WS class doesn't need that skill. There are other alternatives to that such as the sinx Card that is more fair and balanced because when u receive its immunity, you are not able to attack as well else u get exposed. Unlike that Pneuma skill, you get immunity and at the same time be able to deal massive damage. That's unfair 

 

17 hours ago, CarlyRae said:

Again, as I have said, there is the SinxCard that basically gives you the same immunity that Pneuma gives you. Someone asking that Pneuma be maintained as a WS skill is tantamount to  someone asking for a HUGE ADVANTAGE in PVP because there are readily available options to address that issue, hence Pneuma is no longer needed. Winning PVPs because you got a huge advantage is not sweet.