GenericName Posted February 8, 2012 Report Share Posted February 8, 2012 (edited) Okay, so a little while ago Nines suggested a new PvP set. I believe this PvP set should come out with a brand new ladder system. So, here's my idea; New PvP map, with new rules, and new items. And what a great way to release some new PvP gear and make people WORK for it. This 2 week period is kinda stupid because people pvp for 1~3 days and leave the ladder for the rest of the time and win because nobody wants to try anymore, so yeah! 1. 1 week laddering. 2. no parties allowed. 3. if you're caught doing absolutely nothing for 5~10 seconds you're automatically kicked / dc'd from the room. I don't think this should be too hard to script. Discuss. Edited February 8, 2012 by GenericName 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halion Posted February 8, 2012 Report Share Posted February 8, 2012 Exclude the non donation pvp room from the pvp ladder and i'll agree to this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GenericName Posted February 8, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 8, 2012 Exclude the non donation pvp room from the pvp ladder and i'll agree to this. Of course. I think the ND pvp is a useless waste of time anyways. But I think the ND Donation room should be re-done and have like... better rewards or something, but that's a whole new topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xtopher Posted February 8, 2012 Report Share Posted February 8, 2012 (edited) 1. 1 week laddering. 2. no parties allowed. 3. if you're caught doing absolutely nothing for 5~10 seconds you're automatically kicked / dc'd from the room. 1. Don't really care. Just a note though: People aren't pvping for just 1-3 days then calling it GG. People are pvping for two weeks. Ask Tono... hes being going back and forth with this one kid for a week or two now. If you pvp for 1-3 days then quit you're going to lose. 2. Disagree. A lot of classes are dependent on being in party to be useful. Parties are a part of pvp like it or not.... 3. Disagree. Sometimes you have to stand around waiting for people to enter. Getting kicked while waiting for someone to fight seems really annoying. Seems like an unnecessary script/rule. What was your logic behind this suggestion? It seems like you don't want random people just hanging out in the pvp room. I think it's a good thing if they're there. If I see 10 people in the pvp room I'm more likely to go in than 9...8...7..6.. etc.. even if 1-4 of those people are just hanging out. It gets the pvp room active. Edited February 8, 2012 by Xtopher Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GenericName Posted February 8, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 8, 2012 1. Don't really care. Just a note though: People aren't pvping for just 1-3 days then calling it GG. People are pvping for two weeks. Ask Tono... hes being going back and forth with this one kid for a week or two now. If you pvp for 1-3 days then quit you're going to lose. 2. Disagree. A lot of classes are dependent on being in party to be useful. Parties are a part of pvp like it or not.... 3. Disagree. Sometimes you have to stand around waiting for people to enter. Getting kicked while waiting for someone to fight seems really annoying. Seems like an unnecessary script/rule. What was your logic behind this suggestion? I disagree, having a parties allows people to monopolize it, it also turns into who has the bigger party. I really don't believe that's how pvp ladder should be. But thanks for the output! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xtopher Posted February 8, 2012 Report Share Posted February 8, 2012 I disagree, having a parties allows people to monopolize it, it also turns into who has the bigger party. I really don't believe that's how pvp ladder should be. But thanks for the output! I would appreciate a reply to everything I said, not just one part... By removing party play from pvp you indirectly nerf a lot of class' usefulness. Paladin/Priest/Sniper/Wizard/Gunslinger all lose usefulness if you remove parties. Counter Suggestion: Why not just add another room and call it Free For All. In that room you could remove the party system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GenericName Posted February 8, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 8, 2012 I would appreciate a reply to everything I said, not just one part... By removing party play from pvp you indirectly nerf a lot of class' usefulness. Paladin/Priest/Sniper/Wizard/Gunslinger all lose usefulness if you remove parties. Counter Suggestion: Why not just add another room and call it Free For All. In that room you could remove the party system. To be completely honest, the only class REALLY dependant on a party right now is a Champion. Think about all the classes that could FINALLY ladder because not every single person has Defending Aura on. Not only that, Champions wouldn't run as rampant considering Paladins wouldn't be there to take the fall for people wearing reflect. Think about it, full asura champ runs in, and constantly dies to reflect = high death ratio = bad stuff. And when I was more active, I noticed people would pvp really hard the weekend ladder reset, then it would basically sit there for the 2 weeks never changing because it was discouraging to people. If that's changed now, good for it. I'm just looking for a better PvP ladder system. And I see people sitting in PvP talking, chatting it up, and I don't believe that's what PvP is for. I believe it should be a battle contest of who's best and what not. And the 5~10 rule can be neogotiated of course, it was just an example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supream Posted February 8, 2012 Report Share Posted February 8, 2012 pallies have won pvp ladder. priest can still buff without being in a party.gunslingers won ladder, snipers have won ladder, wizards idk. kicking people out of pvp wouldnt be a good idea. most people cheat while no one is on so people afk in there with a video player on to get evidence, but if that happens then you cant do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GenericName Posted February 8, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 8, 2012 Isn't that what GM's are for? And people cheat reglardless, I've seen it happen even while people were watching. And if you script something, I'm sure there's a way to make it so GM's are immune. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supream Posted February 8, 2012 Report Share Posted February 8, 2012 u know gms arent on all the time so people whoa are laddering leave characters in there with a video recorder on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nelly Posted February 8, 2012 Report Share Posted February 8, 2012 Exclude the non donation pvp room from the pvp ladder and i'll agree to this. Still Pvp Ladder.. Cant Really Blame Anyone ,that why They Make Forsaken Elite Set and Forsaken Knight set, if it not this set will be useless?? + it help alot of Newbies with Elite and Knight Set Feel How to ladder in Forsaken-ro Instead of get killed by Veteran that Full Build .__. Of course. I think the ND pvp is a useless waste of time anyways. But I think the ND Donation room should be re-done and have like... better rewards or something, but that's a whole new topic. i dont see any wasting time for being in there without feeding and whole new topic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seraphine Posted February 8, 2012 Report Share Posted February 8, 2012 Isn't that what GM's are for? And people cheat reglardless, I've seen it happen even while people were watching. And if you script something, I'm sure there's a way to make it so GM's are immune. People may cheat but they do get banned from ladder if they are reported or caught by one of the GM's. u know gms arent on all the time so people whoa are laddering leave characters in there with a video recorder on. Supream made a good point,GM's can't be on all the time. Players sometimes need to report the cheaters. Okay, so a little while ago Nines suggested a new PvP set. I believe this PvP set should come out with a brand new ladder system. So, here's my idea; New PvP map, with new rules, and new items. And what a great way to release some new PvP gear and make people WORK for it. This 2 week period is kinda stupid because people pvp for 1~3 days and leave the ladder for the rest of the time and win because nobody wants to try anymore, so yeah! 1. 1 week laddering. 2. no parties allowed. 3. if you're caught doing absolutely nothing for 5~10 seconds you're automatically kicked / dc'd from the room. I don't think this should be too hard to script. Discuss. #3 isn't really necessary in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halion Posted February 8, 2012 Report Share Posted February 8, 2012 Champions don't need a party unless they're in trouble aganist one, even fighting a full party i wouldn't call anyone unless they really kicking my ass, well thats my opinion. Instead of non donation we could make a free for all pvp room that would be cool, different prizes and different ladder system ftw :] @Nelly What is the point in letting newbies get into non donation pvp room if they're going to get bully by the veterans that are laddering in there? your point nelly is to get easy kills more than working for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Decode Posted February 8, 2012 Report Share Posted February 8, 2012 Okay, so a little while ago Nines suggested a new PvP set. I believe this PvP set should come out with a brand new ladder system. So, here's my idea; New PvP map, with new rules, and new items. And what a great way to release some new PvP gear and make people WORK for it. This 2 week period is kinda stupid because people pvp for 1~3 days and leave the ladder for the rest of the time and win because nobody wants to try anymore, so yeah! 1. 1 week laddering. 2. no parties allowed. 3. if you're caught doing absolutely nothing for 5~10 seconds you're automatically kicked / dc'd from the room. I don't think this should be too hard to script. Discuss. Number 1: Hm I don't really mind that. Number 2: I have to agree with Xtopher, there are many class that are basically used for party support, nothing else... And I wouldn't include champion there, if you are a good champion user you are able to take a whole party by yourself. Number 3: Totally disagree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nelly Posted February 8, 2012 Report Share Posted February 8, 2012 @Nelly What is the point in letting newbies get into non donation pvp room if they're going to get bully by the veterans that are laddering in there? your point nelly is to get easy kills more than working for them. Really? 1 week and 4 day i been in there all i can see is they all fully Non-Donation Geared and some of them is Veteran with Non-Donation gear (there also Ungeared Player get in the room But we all know it violate the law ) ,i dont think we can do much if we fighting with other Non-Donation user (that bring Pally,Priest and Champ) or any other class with bigger team then us. atleast we cant get 100 kill in 6 hours like you did in Donation Room because we dont have many Non-Donation User to get easy kill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerynth Posted February 8, 2012 Report Share Posted February 8, 2012 (edited) @Nelly What is the point in letting newbies get into non donation pvp room if they're going to get bully by the veterans that are laddering in there? your point nelly is to get easy kills more than working for them. This wont benefit the newbies at all, how could they get a chance of getting a Sacred or a chance to even get some decent amount of tokens to get geared up. Right now PvP are being monopolized by players who have been playing in the server for a very long time, they have enough support to completely annihilate almost anyone who comes in to PvP room. Unless they totally separate the ND-PvP and Donation PvP to two different entities, then I would agree with everything that you say. If they do separate it, different prizes maybe? Which I am not sure what but something worth laddering for, definitely. In laddering, sadly there aren't many people who ladders with sportsmanship. They tend to flame other people who might or might not have cheated. Quite demoralizing I would say, which I do not blame them for their actions. Sadly because of this, I know some people who do not partake in PvP Laddering because of this reason, another reason why PvP is so less populated. IMO. This can't be changed sadly. :/ Edited February 8, 2012 by Aerynth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xtopher Posted February 8, 2012 Report Share Posted February 8, 2012 A few things I think I should point out. 1. PvP ladders in EVERY GAME are usually dominated by veteran players. If you could ladder as a scrub nub and obtain special items would it be all that worth it? Ladders are always dominated by veterans of said game. Kids joining WoW for two weeks don't get to QQ that they can't compete in the intense PvP sets... why would it be different on our server from any other game. 2. People think that removing parties will promote more fun/fair play... Well let me tell you exactly how it will turn out: -Every champion/sniper that enters will have double attack, provoke, food buffs, assumptio, etc... -Most people will die in one-two super buffed skill shots -Does this adequately show who's the most skilled in PvP or who can alt the most clients for buffs? Paladins are necessary to keep balance in PvP. If you take away their ability to devo all hell will break loose. There won't be any real strategy or "player verses player" circumstances. It tips ladder even more in favor of champions/snipers and any other class that "buffs and burns". 3. Expecting a GM to be online all the time just to kick people who are twiddling their thumbs in the PvP room is naive and a waste of staff resources. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerynth Posted February 8, 2012 Report Share Posted February 8, 2012 A few things I think I should point out. 1. PvP ladders in EVERY GAME are usually dominated by veteran players. If you could ladder as a scrub nub and obtain special items would it be all that worth it? Ladders are always dominated by veterans of said game. Kids joining WoW for two weeks don't get to QQ that they can't compete in the intense PvP sets... why would it be different on our server from any other game. Then tell me what is the point of having a ND PvP Room. 2. People think that removing parties will promote more fun/fair play... Well let me tell you exactly how it will turn out: -Every champion/sniper that enters will have double attack, provoke, food buffs, assumptio, etc... -Most people will die in one-two super buffed skill shots -Does this adequately show who's the most skilled in PvP or who can alt the most clients for buffs? Paladins are necessary to keep balance in PvP. If you take away their ability to devo all hell will break loose. There won't be any real strategy or "player verses player" circumstances. It tips ladder even more in favor of champions/snipers and any other class that "buffs and burns". I agree. 3. Expecting a GM to be online all the time just to kick people who are twiddling their thumbs in the PvP room is naive and a waste of staff resources. I also agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supream Posted February 8, 2012 Report Share Posted February 8, 2012 2. People think that removing parties will promote more fun/fair play... Well let me tell you exactly how it will turn out: -Every champion/sniper that enters will have double attack, provoke, food buffs, assumptio, etc... -Most people will die in one-two super buffed skill shots -Does this adequately show who's the most skilled in PvP or who can alt the most clients for buffs? Paladins are necessary to keep balance in PvP. If you take away their ability to devo all hell will break loose. There won't be any real strategy or "player verses player" circumstances. It tips ladder even more in favor of champions/snipers and any other class that "buffs and burns". one word answers again ill do the same. disagree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xtopher Posted February 8, 2012 Report Share Posted February 8, 2012 Then tell me what is the point of having a ND PvP Room. To amuse people. It's not serious PvP. Only way you'll win ladder through ND room is feeding. one word answers again ill do the same. disagree Ok, not like it matters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meka Meka Posted February 8, 2012 Report Share Posted February 8, 2012 ...1. 1 week laddering. I don't mind we go back to this. 2 Weeks is a lot of time to devote and not everyone can do it. There was a suggestion to half the prize amount if there were economy concerns. ...Counter Suggestion: Why not just add another room and call it Free For All. In that room you could remove the party system. That'd be a cool alternative. I agree that a PVP ladder should be individual against individual. How to make it work? ↓ -Every champion/sniper that enters will have double attack, provoke, food buffs, assumptio, etc... -Most people will die in one-two super buffed skill shots -Does this adequately show who's the most skilled in PvP or who can alt the most clients for buffs? Let's script total debuffer at the NPC. u know gms arent on all the time so people whoa are laddering leave characters in there with a video recorder on. True. There was a suggestion somewhere back to discourage cheating via the broadcaster for the top 3 positions. To amuse people. It's not serious PvP. Only way you'll win ladder through ND room is feeding. Disagree: In general I don't think we should get rid of ND. ND (in theory) is a great place to test your skills and a way to level out everyone with more equal gears (Minus certain donation items that haven't been coded out of it yet). True though, there is good ND players and quality ND matches then there's people taking advantage of it. Having it separated into a different entity might be something worth exploring in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supream Posted February 9, 2012 Report Share Posted February 9, 2012 total debuffer npc you say. ill just ladder on stalker and see how it goes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meka Meka Posted February 9, 2012 Report Share Posted February 9, 2012 total debuffer npc you say. ill just ladder on stalker and see how it goes. There's ways around getting stripped. Anyways, the suggestion was to to mitigate damage based buffs, so obviously you could just leave FCP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supream Posted February 9, 2012 Report Share Posted February 9, 2012 havent seen a debuffer that can chose which buffs to take off Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meka Meka Posted February 9, 2012 Report Share Posted February 9, 2012 Well a player can always get FCP once they're inside, no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
