Alright They Got Shields...

[Kusanagi]

Im actually ok with the shields on Snipers, what doesn't seem right is how Healty they are!, seriously I can hit the 500k wich I cannot with my damn LK.

In my opinion its just not fair how they got such a huge advantage over classes now, divest abilities + High HP + high reductions + VERY high damage + Good weight carriage + no reflection possible + No more magic to kill them...

I mean, they really have every flank covered, its all a battle of hoping the sniper run out of berry's before you do (assuming you began with more than him).

Sugestion clear:

either of this:

1- Lower the HP bonus of tao-gunka card back to the original

2- Make the golden thief bug card only partially reduce magic damage on snipers

3- Make the Thara frog card and usakoring card only do - 15~20% damage on Bow user classes.

4- Reduce damage inflicted when a shield is equipped.

5- Remove the Increase weight ability from all weapons.

6-Put a stick up their... ok forget about that.

Some feedback? :)

[HealHard]

Well, snipers have just normal redux. Same as all other classes. High damage is ranged ONLY with no chance to do any damage to guy in pneuma or the one that uses defending aura. Dont forget about noxious card. It really cuts damage down. Clowns have tarot, stalkers can get another skill to damage/push back etc and snipers can just wait and run. Considering strip, the chances are quite low and it appears only when sniper normally attacks you with bow or you melee him. If its normal attack, that damage is low and easily yggable. If you are sinx then it may be a prob, but any class can strip you... so i dont see big deal at this point.

Considering weight carriage, its nothing special. lvl 10 enlarge weight limit is the only chance for non-str based characters to be able to carry any significant amount of yggs.

And high HP is a bonus for having those drawbacks. btw 500k is smh like 300 vit and vit belts and 2 taos. Not pvp case. Anyway, i cant tell that snipers are overpowered. Strong, but not OP.

Oh and about magic... A good prof still outdamages ANY class if the target is not wearing GTB imo.

[Halion]

there are no good profs anymore, and about the sniper well they just gave a chance to use shield because people couldn't even play sniper since they were always pwnd by anything <,< taking it off is just stupid man!

i think its ok to increase the damage taken from the 35% of usakoring, make it like 25% for snipers , and take out the 15% of stalker soaring bird <,<

if is the case they have to take out that 10% reduction of kitty claws its ok cause they're useless -_- i get same damage like if i were using the elite katar and i do same damage with both of them <,<

[nines]

Wow who the hell are you bitching about? Only other good sniper I really know about would be bass and he doesn't gtb really. And I never put a gtb on and Im very very killable.

How about you just stop your bitching. Why change the reductions.....the most reductions anyone can do on a sniper and do any damage now is freya + Usako and Sgw but that drops ur dmg a ton. Even when I use that setup I still die pretty easy and my damage isn't good enough to kill most people so Im practically always in full dmg setup to kill the person before they can kill me.

Now If you were to reduce the reduction from sheild and cards id demand to be able to stack my other reducts now.

If you lower the hp along with that no one will play the class anymore.

If you reduce damage with a shield...thats a retarded suggestion overall ur a sniper ffs u can pop shield on and off safely from range. This would just piss off lazy people.

Remove weight limit? How about just go fuck your self. and instead of shuve a stick up our asses learn how to duel and not fucking bitch. Jesus I duel gangs and I qq less than anyone on this server atleast realize the ability of ur class and make suggestions on that instead of asking for nerfs which will just ruin the server. (Yes nines stop flaming blah blah blah)

Now Im going to spell out how id duel most shits

Vs Magic users. Arrow Repel them so there no where in range of me. Once they put rsx on burst full dmg while still arrow repeling. No need to wear a gtb because there ygg speed will outdo there spam speed now.

Vs Melee Users. Ankle Snare there asses skid trap my self away. Easy to kite them.

Vs Asura. just try to kill them even while in pneuma.

If I eat an asura now im going to die pretty fuckin easy even with a good amount of hp.

[zac]

I dunno about that my LK gets 500k easily. but anyway. Besides that point.

1- Lower the HP bonus of tao-gunka card back to the original ( i can agree partially)

2- Make the golden thief bug card only partially reduce magic damage on snipers (Disagree)

3- Make the Thara frog card and usakoring card only do - 15~20% damage on Bow user classes. (totally disagree, cause when time comes to tank asura etc they cant. at least b4 they could switch to shield and tank)

4- Reduce damage inflicted when a shield is equipped. (hmm skeptical about this one. i dont think the dmg out isnt that much different from other classes, liek crit dagger sinx, etc.)

5- Remove the Increase weight ability from all weapons. (I would agree to reducing the level to 5 instead of 10)

Edited February 8, 2011 by zac

[Chae Rin]

I think snipers are fine how they are, they were an underpowered class that shot their way to the top tier in order to "balance the classes."

They put up quite a fight but are not such a problem that no one could beat them , unlike stalkers were during the days of super reducts.

This is coming from the perspective of a player who never plays sniper , but have faced many on several other classes.

The ONLY thing I say would be changed/removed if anything at all would the the strip effect on the weapon. I mean strip has nothing to do with the class it's an unnecessary addition really; if you wanted to strip all that just play stalker lol, but anyway i believe there is already a topic on that.

If they decide to remove it then alright.

Besides that I think overall the sniper is fine now.

[nines]

Strip was the main ability thats what made snipers good.

Id be fine letting us have long range dispell and long range strip back while keeping our bows id just card the proper cards in there.

The hp bonus isn't even that great idk what ur qqing about snipers die pretty easy all the time.

[Dudu]

there are no good profs anymore

I'll recommend you to regret saying that. Else you are insultin me and Nines really hard.

And i think Snipers dont need any nerf about defense, they are pretty the same as clowns as in defense and Hp stuff

[Rayray]

I agree with Edu and the others. I still find clowns more annoying than snipers tbh. The reason why some snipers make the class look imbalanced is because most of those people are really, REALLY geared up and are really good(Nines would be an example of a sniper who uses the skills, not just spams DS like most). A normal player(one fking set, dex belts, normal mvp cards and probably an elite sniper bow) is easier to kill than a clown with identical items.

[Kusanagi]

Wow who the hell are you bitching about? Only other good sniper I really know about would be bass and he doesn't gtb really. And I never put a gtb on and Im very very killable.

How about you just stop your bitching. Why change the reductions.....the most reductions anyone can do on a sniper and do any damage now is freya + Usako and Sgw but that drops ur dmg a ton. Even when I use that setup I still die pretty easy and my damage isn't good enough to kill most people so Im practically always in full dmg setup to kill the person before they can kill me.

Now If you were to reduce the reduction from sheild and cards id demand to be able to stack my other reducts now.

If you lower the hp along with that no one will play the class anymore.

If you reduce damage with a shield...thats a retarded suggestion overall ur a sniper ffs u can pop shield on and off safely from range. This would just piss off lazy people.

Remove weight limit? How about just go fuck your self. and instead of shuve a stick up our asses learn how to duel and not fucking bitch. Jesus I duel gangs and I qq less than anyone on this server atleast realize the ability of ur class and make suggestions on that instead of asking for nerfs which will just ruin the server. (Yes nines stop flaming blah blah blah)

Now Im going to spell out how id duel most shits

Vs Magic users. Arrow Repel them so there no where in range of me. Once they put rsx on burst full dmg while still arrow repeling. No need to wear a gtb because there ygg speed will outdo there spam speed now.

Vs Melee Users. Ankle Snare there asses skid trap my self away. Easy to kite them.

Vs Asura. just try to kill them even while in pneuma.

If I eat an asura now im going to die pretty fuckin easy even with a good amount of hp.

I'm particulary speaking about me lol, when I go sniper I can tank better than my LK can, to be honest I dont care about other snipers as they don't use them properly but the Sniper Potential is gigantic at the moment, Considering I don't have that many overpowered equipment and still be able to go overkill mode it just doesn't seem right to me.

I rarely get to speak about something I dont do myself, so could you just shut up nines, every time I try and read what you say i just notice how you just beat up arguments from your butt warts.

I'll recommend you to regret saying that. Else you are insultin me and Nines really hard.

And i think Snipers dont need any nerf about defense, they are pretty the same as clowns as in defense and Hp stuff

Sorry edu didnt read past nines post XD, and... you need more practice you know :o, the wart nines is better than you to be honest.

[supream]

meh prof easy. i can do it with my eyes closed.

[Guest lolensue]

^ true proff is easy.

ok back to topic.

LKs have those ride things which make them carry more yggs possible compared to snipers with bigger HP. (dont reason out bla blah storage bla bla, coz during LMS events etc, @storage wont count and weight is applied)

Snipers have their pros and cons, you should be aware of that.

1. I actually agree to make the old tao go back to natural.

2. Hell No

3. Hell No

4. Hell Yes/No (not really sure, because you actually have a point upon ur reasons but i prefer, let the damage stay when they equip a shield.)

5. and...... NO. remove all weight limit? actually thats a big bozo, some of the classes were given increase weight limit to satisfy their needs. During LMS, youll really see the needs for weight.

[zac]

meh prof easy. i can do it with my eyes closed.

Im sure vs a good prof you wont think so. And im not talking about profs who just spam.

[Sorrow]

500k HP on a sniper...that's only possible with two taos and tons of vit. You want to get a spanking from creators?

I believe Snipers and Stalkers are just on the right place now. I can kill normally both snipers and stalkers during woe where magic gets a 40% penalty(they also can kill me, which means balance, chances for all), i don't see any reason for such complains. If they are giving so much trouble, consider carrying an accessory with Erende Card and you shall be much more happy. The absolute bane of snipers and stalkers; FCP+Pneuma+RSX, If you're a priest, or better yet, a champ just put your Tao/GR+RSX armor and laugh at their faces.

I'm disagreeing with everything.

1-The HP was given cause it was needed, Snipers have a very thin Hp formula.

2-Even as a professor I gotta say; Nerf for all or do not poke at this card, it is not fair.

3-Same as GTB. Shield cards should have same effect for all.

4-Their damage is not anything out of the ordinary, i don't see reason to nerf any of it.

5-Nope. Weight Carriage is of vital importance in here and it comes naturally to classes such a Sinx and Champs, hence why it was given to classes who cannot benefit from STR.

Honestly, you have other much cheaper classes who've been around much longer to worry about other than the newly-promoted into something descent Snipers/Stalkers.

[Kittie]

500k HP on a sniper...that's only possible with two taos and tons of vit. You want to get a spanking from creators?

ikr. I was gonna write that I get 500k HP on my LK with only one tao. What kind of crack is this kid smoking?!

Anyways, I disagree with this whole suggestion.

[L2Aim]

Now that there somewhat is appearing some kind of class balance, the leading classes are complaining. This is always happening and you should try to live with it and find ways around it, e.g noxious cards are one, there are also others that nullify ranged damage, yes I said nullify (do some research on your own).

The point is, the class balance may not be in perfect harmony, but it's reaching a point where we're approaching the idea.

My opinion on this suggestion is that it's not needed to undo the changes or alter them, from all mentioned perspectives (LK, Sniper & Stalker), I am able to say, it's fine.

[xBiscuit]

^ true proff is easy.

ok back to topic.

LKs have those ride things which make them carry more yggs possible compared to snipers with bigger HP. (dont reason out bla blah storage bla bla, coz during LMS events etc, @storage wont count and weight is applied)

Snipers have their pros and cons, you should be aware of that.

1. I actually agree to make the old tao go back to natural.

2. Hell No

3. Hell No

4. Hell Yes/No (not really sure, because you actually have a point upon ur reasons but i prefer, let the damage stay when they equip a shield.)

5. and...... NO. remove all weight limit? actually thats a big bozo, some of the classes were given increase weight limit to satisfy their needs. During LMS, youll really see the needs for weight.

what are your reasons.

back it up, or your " hell no " is invalid.

Edited February 10, 2011 by xBiscuit

[nines]

Most people never have any validity for why the agree or disagree to anything.

[Dudu]

Sorry edu didnt read past nines post XD, and... you need more practice you know :o, the wart nines is better than you to be honest.

Did i ever said that im better than him? No so please learn to read.

@Mike: Prof is easy? Think about it twice before saying it Mike.

@Lolensue: Hahaha that funni reply sir. Prof is not fkin easy. If you think they are. go and fkin make one and pm me ingame.

OnTopic: I think snipers dont need ANY nerfs, actually they need an improvement in traps and things like that. They also need the Fantasmatic arrow to pierce phenuma or w/e

[Guest lolensue]

Hell No - no reason needed because i dont like it. the reason is pretty common.

Hell No is valid for it because i disagreed. even a simple NO does.

and yeah proffs are easy. I cant say we can duel because im not yet geared with my proff here. I dont have the stuffs to do so. But if you go to other same rate server with my proff, i can say its easy. I place all skills at bm, and i know when to use it, even element change just in time. Some of us are fked up because we are far away from the server and get delays.

[Dudu]

Hell No - no reason needed because i dont like it. the reason is pretty common.

Hell No is valid for it because i disagreed. even a simple NO does.

and yeah proffs are easy. I cant say we can duel because im not yet geared with my proff here. I dont have the stuffs to do so. But if you go to other same rate server with my proff, i can say its easy. I place all skills at bm, and i know when to use it, even element change just in time. Some of us are fked up because we are far away from the server and get delays.

Yeah sure, not all the servers has the chance to actually duel a GTB guy, and if you dont have gears here in fRO, 2bad, so stop talkin about profs if u cant actually use one.

And next time dont include the words "other same rate server" cuz its like you dont like this one. ;]

[xXxJCxXx]

I main sniper so maybe I'm a bit bias here.

1- Lower the HP bonus of tao-gunka card back to the original

No. Snipers are fine as they are in their HP right now. Normally i reach up to less than 300k HP without sacrificing damage. Reducing the HP buff from Tao Gunka will make the class die easily or sacrifice loads of damage.

2- Make the golden thief bug card only partially reduce magic damage on snipers

No. Switching to GTB sacrifices the sniper's reducts and they become very vulnerable to physical attacks. Tanking magic attack and physical attack while wearing gtb with this effects will make this class dig up his/her own grave and if you ask me I won't wear GTB anymore if it has this effects.

3- Make the Thara frog card and usakoring card only do - 15~20% damage on Bow user classes.

No. Distance is a sniper's friend once it is eliminated, sniper's become very vulnerable to anything. Reducing the % damage from usakoring and thara for bow classes only is too specific as well.

4- Reduce damage inflicted when a shield is equipped.

No. Damage inflicted by Sniper's right now are ok but not really overpowered. Also to get great deal of damage you have to be skilled enough to change arrow elements depending on your target. People are still able to tank sniper's damage with the custom changes.

5- Remove the Increase weight ability from all weapons.

I carry some bunch of stuff like traps, speed potions, aloe vera, food, sometimes verters, removing this will lessen the amount of consumables I can carry so I may have to say no. Lessen it to a lower level maybe is acceptable but as the others said weight becomes very crucial on LMS reducing this will make LMS dominated by strength based characters as they can carry more consumables as to the other classes.

In summary, this class was underpowered before and since the server is aiming for class balance they came up with the custom changes and this made sniper a playable class but not to the point of going to the dark side (overpowered). Removing some/all of the custom changes will make this class underpowered again and less people will play this class.

[Drax]

u tell em edu :3

[Guest lolensue]

ok i wont talk anymore, this gona be last. I just agreed to supreamus post, why the f put all the flame to me?! im a person who wants to defend myself, when i say a word, i mean it and i wont take it back. If its hard for you, its easy for me.

[Masahiro]

uhhh theres a lot op STUPID bias above

dont in any way those who are trying to make sniper look like a crippled class speak anymore, your opinion has been rejected

onto people who have actually researched anything before they state their claims.

sniper and the lot are good classes, it IS balanced atm

HOWEVER. the hp they attain from 2x tao is greater than the hp other classes attain for obvious reasons

EVEN lk.

snipers have a good advantage atm, its not ridiculous but they have become the new "clown" in terms of the Acceptable Op-ness, just because tarot made the clowns redicu doesnt mean the lack there of means a class is balanced.

snipers have some amazing FAS that once it tags on person goes on almost infinitely in that direction , making it a multi-hit asura along a Vector. (someone from across the map e.g in GVG or LMs can get surprised and overwhelmed quite easily..ever heard of collateral?)

FA is Gospel enabled, and spammable as hell, so it literally IS a ranged mini-asura, unlike a ninja's FS it doenst bring your hp down to One and it has the auto bapho. just this fact alone propels sniper to the front lines as an amazingly strong class.

Auto strip makes snipers abusive, this amazes me everytime that people don't notice this.

if my fcp runs out or im unlucky enough to not have had it period, i am almost guaranteed to die to a sniper. do NOT say that strip occurs only in a 3 cell range or w/e, because then your ignoring the fact that

most of the classes are melle oriented, the only ones who will NOt be as affected are Mage class and other Archer class. that is not fair.

the real issue at hand is their hp in combination with this auto strip

the bonus provided by tao means that a fully statted sniper, vs a fully statted LK, the sniper has more hp..and LKs are the HP whores of the game.

this-is-not-right..

basically to sum up a sniper we have the ability to tank just about everything, to repel individuals if they get to near, the ability to strip them if they DID manage to come within melle range, the ability to hold a large quantity of yggs/ seeds..oh and not to mention the ability to do damage AT RANGE.

yes, Range is the determining factor that influences ALL else..

a sniper can kill you before you even Touch him...*touch*

their hp ability is shadowed only to super novices (which is ANOTHER story entirely..700k hp? wtf?) and stalkers..

stalkers being another ranged class.

MEANTIME..champs have a horrible hp mod and asura which everyone bears into consideration when making their build

the only EFFICIENT champs are those that use 2x thana weapons, OR are always on full asura and/or gospel which forces them to become even LESS defensible and hence the reliance on Paladin devotions.

the only time i die to a champ nowadays is when im being careless or hes gospelled+ in a gang

Snipers hold an immense number of yggs which they do NOT burn through as rapidly as other so-called tanker classes such as the lk.

the enlarge 10 weight is fine, they lack the 300 str the LKs and others have to have weight limit, so that is balanced.

snipers have AUTO STRIP on their bow..this amazes me, not only do they wield a single-hand bow but they have the ability to juggle Arrows and Strip you with them on their other hand,

best you just gave them an assault rifle instead, because they are murderers

Edited February 12, 2011 by Masahiro