Tao Gunka Effects On Creator

[Josef]

Still weird how you do 200-500 when I can do 700 on a creator with no int belt and was made mainly for surviving. Well, it's your build, don't wanna mess with it.

In the end, I still don't think it's necessary for creators to get the tao boost. Given they can wear tao at any given time with the immunity to strip and breakage from FCP. Unlike others who has to wear RSX and give up tao for their armors not to break.

I'm done. Have a good night.

[Forum~]

Lmao you're a funny man, yea i can say the same thing for other classes and all I'm asking for is to increase a little more hp on Tao gunka for creators stop making it sound like i want creators to be over powered and you're saying things that dont make sense high cold bolt dmg? strong mammonite dmg? If you never played or tested out a creator using mammonite you should because its basically shit.. max out your str 2x fbh your dmg is close to decent and

Cold bolt has good damage if you use it strategically (switching between AD and bolting).

I'm referring to a "strong mammonite dmg" considering if this measure was approved. Then as you said, with the additional HP, creators would have the ability to invest into stat points such as str and int, THUS resulting in a stronger mammonite. In addition, you have to consider that you can also bolt, then when they switch to GTB, you now have the option to mammonite probably around 30-50k with ice pick/thana (remember, people wear Rays/GR/Devs when fighting creator, thus no skolls + no Usakoring because they have GTB on).

You strip people daily? can you say go kill noobs?

I used it as an example to counter-argue your outlandish claim of "95%". Every so often, I do get bored and play stalker. And yes, I strip "noobs" as well as "pros".

before you start posting know your facts and read the thread topic okay bud?

The reason I began posting is because I do know my facts and I have read the entire thread topic to reason my point.

If your counterclaims are basically pushing off my argument, my time here is done and I believe I've made my point.

PS: Lose the attitude, yeah?

Edited April 9, 2010 by Forum~

[bankai`]

Still weird how you do 200-500 when I can do 700 on a creator with no int belt and was made mainly for surviving. Well, it's your build, don't wanna mess with it.

In the end, I still don't think it's necessary for creators to get the tao boost. Given they can wear tao at any given time with the immunity to strip and breakage from FCP. Unlike others who has to wear RSX and give up tao for their armors not to break.

I'm done. Have a good night.

Okay not a huge diffrence but like i said you're main is not creator i assume so you wouldn't know..

Trust me tao is a must without it you're dead dude, and again who doesn't have FCP now and days... its not a huge boost in creator, but if it was add less vit more str or int in my opinion not over powering at all just a little improvement in creators

[bankai`]

Cold bolt has good damage if you use it strategically (switching between AD and bolting).

I'm referring to a "strong mammonite dmg" considering if this measure was approved. Then as you said, with the additional HP, creators would have the ability to invest into stat points such as str and int, THUS resulting in a stronger mammonite. In addition, you have to consider that you can also bolt, then when they switch to GTB, you now have the option to mammonite probably around 30-50k with ice pick/thana (remember, people wear Rays/GR/Devs when fighting creator, thus no skolls + no Usakoring because they have GTB on).

I used it as an example to counter-argue your outlandish claim of "95%". Every so often, I do get bored and play stalker. And yes, I strip "noobs" as well as "pros".

The reason I began posting is because I do know my facts and I have read the entire thread topic to reason my point.

If your counterclaims are basically pushing off my argument, my time here is done and I believe I've made my point.

PS: Lose the attitude, yeah?

Yea you're right but not everyone has a thana or icepick but then again icepick dont work as good as thana they do 5k-10k the most i've seen with decent vits not to high including using skolls and rays. You also have to think because creators dont have much options compare to other classes there skills dont work as good as bowling bash compare to mammonite and also cold bolt is lvl 3 so it wont get you anywhere..

Counter-argue okay when the last time you've fight a geared person without fcp? If he had no fcp the reason might be he forgot to get it or he had no more so he wouldn't come back

And you obviously dont know you're just stating things which i can too with other classes look at the ability and the lvl and how good it works for the class before you start saying creator have a variety of skills which lvl 3 cold bolt isn't and mammonite don't seem to work as good with a mass stat adding..

Attitude what attitude? can you see my emotional face expression? you have powers lol?

[Forum~]

Yea you're right but not everyone has a thana or icepick but then again icepick dont work as good as thana they do 5k-10k the most i've seen with decent vits not to high including using skolls and rays. You also have to think because creators dont have much options compare to other classes there skills dont work as good as bowling bash compare to mammonite and also cold bolt is lvl 3 so it wont get you anywhere..

Icepick is almost as effective as Thana when the enemy doesn't have Skolls and Usakoring on; and no, they won't do 5k-10k when the target has GTB and Rays equipped. I based my calculations considering Tao WAS boosted for creators->thus additional stats to invest onto str=mammonite damage.

I believe the recent updates made Creator dagger have the ability to use Level 5 Cold bolt.

Creator is not a LK.

Counter-argue okay when the last time you've fight a geared person without fcp? If he had no fcp the reason might be he forgot to get it or he had no more so he wouldn't come back

Probably last Sunday (considering I play only on Friday+weekends).

And you obviously dont know you're just stating things which i can too with other classes look at the ability and the lvl and how good it works for the class before you start saying creator have a variety of skills which lvl 3 cold bolt isn't and mammonite don't seem to work as good with a mass stat adding..

Grammer please, I'm too tired to make out what your trying to say here. Restate in next comment please.

Attitude what attitude? can you see my emotional face expression? you have powers lol?

I was referring to your condescending diction choice. And, here again, you're using your smart-ass attitude.

My main is not a creator but it would be nice to see a hp boost for tao gunka on creators since they are so dam easy to nurf AD main skill =[

Okay not a huge diffrence but like i said you're main is not creator i assume so you wouldn't know..

Contradiction/hypocrite? So "i assume so you wouldn't know..".

Edited April 9, 2010 by Forum~

[bankai`]

Icepick is almost as effective as Thana when the enemy doesn't have Skolls and Usakoring on; and no, they won't do 5k-10k when the target has GTB and Rays equipped. I based my calculations considering Tao WAS boosted for creators->thus additional stats to invest onto str=mammonite damage.

I believe the recent updates made Creator dagger have the ability to use Level 5 Cold bolt.

Creator is not a LK.

Probably last Sunday (considering I play only on Friday+weekends).

Grammer please, I'm too tired to make out what your trying to say here. Restate in next comment please.

I was referring to your condescending diction choice.

Contradiction? So "i assume so you wouldn't know..".

Not even close where have you been thanatos work much better then icepick they are both easily nurf so lets get off the topic

Its not my fault you're cracked out and you can't read what i type maybe you should take a rest kid..

actually if you have Skoll and rays gr and tao on it lowers by 1000 and under if you're not fully int which is stupid because that's to much stat which wont benefit scrap and that's a fact

[Forum~]

Not even close where have you been thanatos work much better then icepick they are both easily nurf so lets get off the topic

actually if you have Skoll and rays gr and tao on it lowers by 1000 and under if you're not fully int which is stupid because that's to much stat which wont benefit scrap and that's a fact

When you have GTB and Rays on (no resistance), I highly doubt there would be a exponential difference between the absurd damage from Thana or Icepick (basically what I'm trying to say is that you'll still be dead in the end).

YES, I ACKNOWLEDGE THAT THANA/ICEPICK IS EASILY NERFED.

And no, it's not easily nerfed in the creator class' situation. Let me explain to you this delicate balance (according to what you're trying to aim for):

You use AD-> enemy uses GR+Usakoring+Rays/Devs; THUS AD is ineffective.

You switch to Cold Bolt-> enemy uses GR+Rays/Devs. They switch to GTB (MAYBE, they'll continue using Usakoring).

You use Ice pick/Thana-> without Skolls/Usako, you rape them.

Consider they switch to Skolls now-> you AD the shit out of them, thus another rape situation.

*ENDLESS CYCLE*

I conclude that this would make creator's OP.

Its not my fault you're cracked out and you can't read what i type maybe you should take a rest kid..

I can read fine. Maybe, your grammar sucks ass and that's the reason why I'm not willing to decipher your message.

Instead of going off onto unrelated tangents, can you address how creator wouldn't be OP according to my reasoning?

Edited April 9, 2010 by Forum~

[bankai`]

When you have GTB and Rays on (no resistance), I highly doubt there would be a exponential difference between the absurd damage from Thana or Icepick (basically what I'm trying to say is that you'll still be dead in the end).

YES, I ACKNOWLEDGE THAT THANA/ICEPICK IS EASILY NERFED.

And no, it's not easily nerfed in the creator class' situation. Let me explain to you this delicate balance (according to what you're trying to aim for):

You use AD-> enemy uses GR+Usakoring+Rays/Devs; THUS AD is ineffective.

You switch to Cold Bolt-> enemy uses GR+Rays/Devs. They switch to GTB (MAYBE, they'll continue using Usakoring).

You use Ice pick/Thana-> without Skolls/Usako, you rape them.

Consider they switch to Skolls now-> you AD the shit out of them, thus another rape situation.

*ENDLESS CYCLE*

I conclude that this would make creator's OP.

I can read fine. Maybe, your grammar sucks ass and that's the reason why I'm not willing to decipher your message.

Instead of going off onto unrelated tangents, can you address how creator wouldn't be OP according to my reasoning?

Okay you're just assuming what happens and you make it sound so god dam easy

You should just cancel out Icepick and thanatos because you have to have a decent amount of str to do good dmg unless the person has no skoll which im talking about a decent or pro point of view so your options are only Cold bolt and AD

AD easy dont take to much to nerf just gr tao and rays and you're fine.

Only effort i actually put into my grammar is my exam papers or essays what make you diffrent? Yea missing comas and period and capitalization, still can't read then that makes you retarded

Your tactics off fighting a creator is so poor "yea use this use that then change to that equip" before you saying anything, thanatos required a lot of str to be decent fighting a pro/decent player, for it being so easy nerf and your only option is coma which is by luck and Cold bolt lvl 5 then AD all easy to nerf this boost won't effect creator by a lot so stop thinking its the end of the world but truly creator need this boost

[The Black Santa]

I lol at this topic. /heh

[bankai`]

I lol at this topic. /heh

Don't you always? lol...

[Cirrus]

How about an example?

I play a High Wiz for PvP, I have way less HP than a Creator (even with the Tao Boost, as supream has said before, 50% of nothing is still nothing,) I need FBHs cause I need to squeeze every % of MATK in the game, after my FCP wears off (which I didn't cast myself too) I can get stripped or get my armor broken, I can't carry much supplies so I really can't wait for an FCP to run out, I don't have a cart, I can't run fast for free, or code a nice homun AI to cast bolts for me, I can't melee to save my life and I don't even have alternate builds to play with, my Thana Stave gets countered by 20 coupons worth of Skoll cards, I can't even spam Stave Crasher that nicely cause it's spam rate is horrible, I can't coma... well because that one card (cough) that renders me useless also blocks it. ): And I'm not complaining yet.

Now for a Creator... HP is decent, you can even get 220k+ on a proper build. You don't need FBHs to have good AD damage, you have the option of not defaulting them, their FCP doesn't wear off, hence immunity to strip and break, they have Increase Weight Limit AND a cart to carry supplies, they have the option of a Lif to run fast, or a coded Vanil to help out with bolts, they have the option of using Edge or a hybrid STR build with a Mammo/Ifrit Rings(Asura), they can benefit from a neutral element spammable skill, then they can use an Ice Pick or Thanatos to exploit neutral reducts, and with an Edge or Guillotine they CAN Coma. Creators have lots of options.

The point is, every class has its advantages and disadvantages. For a creator, you can't just fight off the bat against prepared people, but it's advantages are obvious in long running events where you can't restock or re-FCP. With FCP scrolls going null in the next content update (hopefully) you won't have those people who keep FCP on all the time in said events. If you're smart you can do a lot of things with a Creator, while it may not have the best damage output, your character's skills speak for itself, that is, you barely have offensive skills and skills that support your offensive skills.

More HP isn't always the answer. We aren't making every class a SinX or LK or Pally or Champion. If you want more HP or damage go play another class. Creators are fine, sure they can use a boost, but not HP.

Edited April 9, 2010 by Cirrus

[Forum~]

Okay you're just assuming what happens and you make it sound so god dam easy

I assume this because because it is so god damn easy.

"You use AD-> enemy uses GR+Usakoring+Rays/Devs; THUS AD is ineffective...*ENDLESS CYCLE*"

In theory, I would say this is almost fail proof (considering one knows how to play creator).

You should just cancel out Icepick and thanatos because you...truly creator need this boost

(Shortening the quotes because it's getting repetitive.)

Lol, this is going in circles. I think I've stated "assume your Tao boost went into effect for creators" like 5 times. You said it yourself, with this, you would be able to invest more stats into str or int. This would mean a decent mammonite and more so if you used it with ice pick/thana. You have to consider the dilemma of the enemy deciding what to use against a creator who could use both thana and a strong neutral damage skill.

I know this isn't the case for fRO, but the point I'm trying to get across is to imagine this (analogy approaching...):

Let's say Thana worked with champion class for ONLY TSS. Wouldn't you think it's OP if they could do this? You have to put on skolls so his TSS wouldn't hurt, but if you put on skolls, then you're defenseless against his asura. It applies vice-versa when wearing Rays/Devs. It's OP.

I'm trying to equate this to the creator from what you are suggesting. Sure, it's not exactly the same, but this gives an unfair advantage.

Only effort i actually put into my grammar is my exam papers or essays what make you diffrent? Yea missing comas and period and capitalization, still can't read then that makes you retarded

I agree that online, a certain amount of simplicity is alright... but it's hard to understand when there aren't any punctuations...

EXAMPLE (sort of off-topic):

Reason for the importance of punctuation- May lead to misunderstanding.

"Woman, without her man, is nothing" and "Woman: without her, man is nothing"

"He eats shoots and leaves" and "He eats, shoots and leaves"

It makes you look stupid, so please, give it a try.

LOL, AND NICELY STATED CIRRUS.

Edited April 9, 2010 by Forum~

[bankai`]

I assume this because because it is so god damn easy.

"You use AD-> enemy uses GR+Usakoring+Rays/Devs; THUS AD is ineffective...*ENDLESS CYCLE*"

In theory, I would say this is almost fail proof (considering one knows how to play creator).

(Shortening the quotes because it's getting repetitive.)

Lol, this is going in circles. I think I've stated "assume your Tao boost went into effect for creators" like 5 times. You said it yourself, with this, you would be able to invest more stats into str or int. This would mean a decent mammonite and more so if you used it with ice pick/thana. You have to consider the dilemma of the enemy deciding what to use against a creator who could use both thana and a strong neutral damage skill.

I know this isn't the case for fRO, but the point I'm trying to get across is to imagine this (analogy approaching...):

Let's say Thana worked with champion class for ONLY TSS. Wouldn't you think it's OP if they could do this? You have to put on skolls so his TSS wouldn't hurt, but if you put on skolls, then you're defenseless against his asura. It applies vice-versa when wearing Rays/Devs. It's OP.

I'm trying to equate this to the creator from what you are suggesting. Sure, it's not exactly the same, but this gives an unfair advantage.

I agree that online, a certain amount of simplicity is alright... but it's hard to understand when there aren't any punctuations...

EXAMPLE (sort of off-topic):

Reason for the importance of punctuation- May lead to misunderstanding.

"Woman, without her man, is nothing" and "Woman: without her, man is nothing"

"He eats shoots and leaves" and "He eats, shoots and leaves"

It makes you look stupid, so please, give it a try.

LOL, AND NICELY STATED CIRRUS.

so your saying what i've said is correct

I'm trying to get out is like any other class GS, Super novice, Wizzard got a hp boost on Tao Gunka why not boost the creator offensive ability meaning invest in stats to put in something more useful

Yea it wasn't that outrageous so relax on that part

[Forum~]

so your saying what i've said is correct

No. =.=;

I'm trying to get out is like any other class GS, Super novice, Wizzard got a hp boost on Tao Gunka why not boost the creator offensive ability meaning invest in stats to put in something more useful

*Points to Cirrus' post.*

Yea it wasn't that outrageous so relax on that part

It was scandalous!

...

Well, I'm done contributing to this topic. I wonder how it will turn out. PEACE.

[bankai`]

How about an example?

I play a High Wiz for PvP, I have way less HP than a Creator (even with the Tao Boost, as supream has said before, 50% of nothing is still nothing,) I need FBHs cause I need to squeeze every % of MATK in the game, after my FCP wears off (which I didn't cast myself too) I can get stripped or get my armor broken, I can't carry much supplies so I really can't wait for an FCP to run out, I don't have a cart, I can't run fast for free, or code a nice homun AI to cast bolts for me, I can't melee to save my life and I don't even have alternate builds to play with, my Thana Stave gets countered by 20 coupons worth of Skoll cards, I can't even spam Stave Crasher that nicely cause it's spam rate is horrible, I can't coma... well because that one card (cough) that renders me useless also blocks it. ): And I'm not complaining yet.

Now for a Creator... HP is decent, you can even get 220k+ on a proper build. You don't need FBHs to have good AD damage, you have the option of not defaulting them, their FCP doesn't wear off, hence immunity to strip and break, they have Increase Weight Limit AND a cart to carry supplies, they have the option of a Lif to run fast, or a coded Vanil to help out with bolts, they have the option of using Edge or a hybrid STR build with a Mammo/Ifrit Rings(Asura), they can benefit from a neutral element spammable skill, then they can use an Ice Pick or Thanatos to exploit neutral reducts, and with an Edge or Guillotine they CAN Coma. Creators have lots of options.

The point is, every class has its advantages and disadvantages. For a creator, you can't just fight off the bat against prepared people, but it's advantages are obvious in long running events where you can't restock or re-FCP. With FCP scrolls going null in the next content update (hopefully) you won't have those people who keep FCP on all the time in said events. If you're smart you can do a lot of things with a Creator, while it may not have the best damage output, your character's skills speak for itself, that is, you barely have offensive skills and skills that support your offensive skills.

More HP isn't always the answer. We aren't making every class a SinX or LK or Pally or Champion. If you want more HP or damage go play another class. Creators are fine, sure they can use a boost, but not HP.

Didn't see this post lol just went straight for the last post yea i guess you're right on that =]

[supream]

if u think creators are so underpowered ill give u a few suggestions that will satisfy most people. make the bottles for AD in the mall more affordable. make the ad skill do 75% max dmg to demi humans instead of 50%. make creator weapon do lvl 5 cold bolt. thats all i can give thats not op.

[bankai`]

if u think creators are so underpowered ill give u a few suggestions that will satisfy most people. make the bottles for AD in the mall more affordable. make the ad skill do 75% max dmg to demi humans instead of 50%. make creator weapon do lvl 5 cold bolt. thats all i can give thats not op.

I never said they were so underpowered all i said was increase there hp so we can invest in other stats just some upgrades on offensive ability for the creators and yes what you said could work..

Everything is being talked about on another thread instead of this one. -_-

http://forum.forsaken-ro.net/index.php?showtopic=16900

Edited April 9, 2010 by Flair

[Flair]

Please avoid double posting. If you forget to say something from your previous post, just edit it. Thank you.

Also, the link you gave is this same thread.

[Annie]

I'll take this extra HP anytime ;D