Penis Posted August 27, 2009 Report Posted August 27, 2009 Hi everyone! This is Penis! (No offense meant there, it's just my name). I used to play legit servers years ago and we always used to have Eluniums as the most important items that held the market together. They signify a very important part of the RPG element of the game, viz., the ability to Upgrade armor. This was however, shot to death after things like Ice Pick and Thanatos came out. So, I suggest we bring in a new substitute to Eluniums: [insert a cool name here]. These would work in a way similar to Upgrading using Eluniums but would offer different kinds of bonuses when used. It does not have to be a DEF upgrade (which everyone hates), but something like this: Armors: HP Bonus Helms: SP Bonus Mid and Low Headgear: Movement Speed Bonus Shields: Damage Reduction Shoes: Attack Speed Bonus (or maybe something else) We can always change the above items to make things balanced. I leave that open for the community to decide. If this does take off, it would help the economy a lot by adding an item that is very well sought after. I hope you guys like this idea :-) - Penis (PS: This name was not my idea.)
Millenia Posted August 27, 2009 Report Posted August 27, 2009 - Penis (PS: This name was not my idea.) HEHEHEHEHEH I DA GENIUS, HEH!
Adamxd Posted August 27, 2009 Report Posted August 27, 2009 (edited) "F" items [cloak, shield, helm, armor, shoes] already have bonuses like that. Elite sets too. Edited August 27, 2009 by Adamxd
Penis Posted August 27, 2009 Author Report Posted August 27, 2009 "F" items [cloak, shield, helm, armor, shoes] already have bonuses like that. Elite sets too. I know but I'm talking about having something more. Not being able to upgrade an item in a RPG game is just not right. A player should be able to say "HEY MAN LOOK AT MY +10 ITANZ I ROX KIZZ MY AZZ" to everyone around him. I'm not saying these bonuses should be something totally radical (like +100% more HP).. we can always balance those things out. The core idea of being able to upgrade your stuff is what I'm trying to point to.
kuoch Posted August 27, 2009 Report Posted August 27, 2009 Well, we already have a +10 refiner. So it's kinda pointless of shower you're "ZOMG I GOTZ +10 F-ARMOR" or anything of it.
orthikuss Posted August 27, 2009 Report Posted August 27, 2009 i think its too late ... to implement this yummy idea @__@ add % to failed - more challenge ... balance +1 (90%) -->wood (wood forsaken king armor) xD +2 (90%) -->stone (stone forsaken king boots) ~~heavy!! +3 (90%) -->steel +4 (90%) -->bronze +5 (60%) -->silver +6 (40%) -->gold (gold golden valk helm) 'o__0 +7 (40%) -->titanium +8 (20%) -->mithril +9 (20%) -->demon/hell +10 (10%) -->angel/godly (godly forsaken king boots) @__@ good luck!
Yuki Posted August 27, 2009 Report Posted August 27, 2009 Pointless, close it please. The idea isn't pointless. I actually find this idea kind of interesting, but it wouldn't work for our server. On fRO, having a +10 Elite Gear/+10 Forsaken King Gear is actually considered a bad thing. The reason for that is there are many Thanatos Cards around (do more damage based on your defense), so having a +10 Forsaken King Gear/Elite Gear would resolve in some horrific damage. Considering Adamxd's post about already having Forsaken King Gear and Elite Sets, he has a point. I would like to expand on it though. Yes, they do have status bonuses, but adding like an HP bonus / SP bonus / Movement Speed / Damage Redudction / Etc., would soon be considered overpowered. We already have many items that could be considered overpowered, and I don't think we need any more of that though. I'll leave this open for discussion. Thank you for your suggestion, though.
Kittie Posted August 27, 2009 Report Posted August 27, 2009 I think what he's getting at is the +10 wouldn't go towards defense anymore, but instead the other stat bonuses. And this idea pointless? Look at the other suggestions. Please. LOL. :rolleyes:
Yuki Posted August 27, 2009 Report Posted August 27, 2009 (edited) I think what he's getting at is the +10 wouldn't go towards defense anymore, but instead the other stat bonuses. And this idea pointless? Look at the other suggestions. Please. LOL. :rolleyes: Oh, right. If it were to go to other stat bonuses, we would then have to discuss the stats/bonuses, and if it would be considered overpowered or not.. Edited August 27, 2009 by Venus
Rayray Posted August 27, 2009 Report Posted August 27, 2009 why not make it have a chance to fail? and the item to be used for it is hard to get(mvp drop or quest). would that still make it overpowered? I might be expanding on the suggestion a little, but i would like the idea of having "something" added on my gears just like an upgrade but not necessarily like one.
Yuki Posted August 27, 2009 Report Posted August 27, 2009 why not make it have a chance to fail? and the item to be used for it is hard to get(mvp drop or quest). would that still make it overpowered? I might be expanding on the suggestion a little, but i would like the idea of having "something" added on my gears just like an upgrade but not necessarily like one. The suggestion to have it have a chance to fail is kind of iffy. Nobody would want to have their Forsaken King Gears broken, it would be like donating for one then throwing it away if they failed. 90-100 coupons down the drain for Forsaken King Gears, and around 5-10(?) coupons down the drain for Elite Gears. Also, are you talking about like an item used for refining (eg. orideconds, eluniums)? I wouldn't say it would be overpowered, it just depends on how many stats you're giving. Although, you are on to something. What if we have this item you're talking about, and make it so that if you use it, you'll get a 100% chance of working. And sure, I think you're expanding on the idea. Having something on my gears does sound appealing as well, but we still have to think of the overall balance of the server.
Devotion Posted August 27, 2009 Report Posted August 27, 2009 It wouldn't necessarily be overpowered since you can't change how you upgrade your gear. If you upgrade an farmor with +10 Str (let's use that as an example), the armor wouldn't be as useful for mages or any class not requiring that skill primarily. This reduces the selling possability of your item, and the usability for yourself. Instead of having the gear break at a chance, what if we had the upgrade catalyst only work at a very small percent. So you'd have to hunt/make tons of them to get one upgraded gear. And if you had to huntt hese items then the custom mob would drop them sparingly. And if you had to quest them, it'd be a long annoying quest. That way it's not 'poof' I got my awesome armor.
Yuki Posted August 27, 2009 Report Posted August 27, 2009 Using your example with the +10 STR, we would probably have to range between the classes. Example: If Lord Knight, Paladin, Assassin Cross, Whitesmith. (Example) = STR +10. If Professor, High Wizard, Soul Linker, or Stalker, = INT + 10. If INSERTCLASSHERE = STAT + 10. The idea of not breaking the armor sounds good as well as the catalyst working at a low percentage. The quest idea sounds appealing, but if it were just for a +1 on an armor, then I don't think it really does. You have to consider all the other gears as well (cloaks, boots, shields, helmets). Personally, I find the monsters dropping the catalyst sounds the best to me.
Kusanagi Posted August 27, 2009 Report Posted August 27, 2009 (edited) I dont wanna be a partycrasher but... its not that easy to make lol. You have either do a massive recode on the upgrade system or create new item IDs with said bonuses (wich means only one lvl of upgrade with fixed bonuses). everything else is easy :P. But indeed its a good Idea :S ONLY if your equipment can be broken. I dont consider it as a loss, after all you know what you are facing and if you are planing to do it you will do it on your own risk, and If you were to just need to hunt the items over again then it would cause an overflow in the items with such bonuses (Unless the chances were to be so low its not even something people will bother under normal circumstances). Well said in short: 1- With chances to be broken and fixed decent bonuses (5-10% [insert variable]) 2- Absurdly low chances and items considered hard to obtain. 3- Castle loot drops (wrath of valk,etc etc etc) needed to be used in certain amount with no breaking chance. After all the point of the upgrading its that it heavily relies in luck and even with effort its not a certainty. That of course if This was really going to be implemented. Edited August 27, 2009 by Kusanagi
Yuki Posted August 27, 2009 Report Posted August 27, 2009 (edited) That is a very good point about the new item #ID's and the massive recoding. The idea is appealing, but is definitely a lot of work. As for the bonuses, we wouldn't want something that would overpower, nor something so useless that players would bother with. Also, it depends on the probability and difficulty of the quest/drop percentage. So you have a point there as well. Edited August 27, 2009 by Venus
Anarii Posted August 27, 2009 Report Posted August 27, 2009 (edited) The idea sounds pretty appealing to me. The chances of fail/success should mirror that of the original refiner, and the catalyst at a decent drop rate; not too high so that it takes a few seconds to get, but enough so that even a small economy can be made for the catalysts. As for stats I'm not too sure, but why not bring in some custom cards requiring a refine rate? Could be an improved version of a card we already have (e.g Improved Tao Gunka +40% Hp Req. refine 9~10). Overpowering shouldn't be a problem, since making a high refined item would be a feat, and the player would think twice before possibly throwing a 100 coupon farmor down the drain. And lastly, this could be the "expansion" that some of our players are wishing for. edit: I like this idea since it would be (imo) an update that would distinguish us from other servers, not just the new item updates we've been getting, that certainly does not distinguish us from other servers. it could potentially have the magnitude that the elite quest had, when it came out. btw i write 2 long.. sigh.. read tho pls! Edited August 27, 2009 by Anarii
Adamxd Posted August 28, 2009 Report Posted August 28, 2009 uh What about players who already have items +10? Well nowadays i think items +10 are cheaper than+0 becuz of thana rape right? It's impossbile for our lovely server.
Sorrow Posted August 28, 2009 Report Posted August 28, 2009 (edited) What if...Instead of fixed bonuses to the pieces of equipment we had separate stone/minerals to add certain abilities? As in... Fire Ruby>+1 STR Wind Emerald>+1 DEX Water Saphire>+1 INT Earth Topaz>+1 VIT Light Diamond>+3 AGL Dark Amethyst>+5 LCK That way it could help some complement their builds(like exemple;in my prof, my int ends with a 6...and i really can't seem to get the +4 i need to complement the multiple of 10 thingy...) AGL and LCK are higher because everyone know that they don't make any difference at all unless they are in (very)high numbers. Compatibility; some pieces of equipments can only be changed with certain stones. Like Helmet* accepts Ruby(STR), Emerald(DEX) and Water(INT). Armors accept only Topaz(VIT). Cloacks&Boots go for Diamond(AGL) and Amethyst(LCK). One thing; Each peice of equipment can only be upgraded with ONE stone and one stone only. *Helmet; only the top headgear can be refined...or one headgear that uses more slots than one. Chance of fail; They would be high on higher levels...this way making normally boosts for stats to round up builds would be easy, but making the max boost to add up to an alread round up build would be very difficult. Could work like this... LV.0~1 50% chance of success. 50% chance of failing. LV.1~2 45% chance of success. 55% chance of failing. LV.2~3 40% chance of success. 60% chance of failing. LV.3~4 35% chance of success. 65% chance of failing. LV.4~5 30% chance of success. 70% chance of failing. LV.5~6 20% chance of success. 70% chance of failing. 10% chance of revert. LV.6~7 10% chance of success. 70% chance of failing. 20% chance of revert. LV.7~8 10% chance of success. 50% chance of failing. 30% chance of revert. 10% chance of critical failure. LV.8~9 10% chance of success. 30% chance of failing. 40% chance of revert. 20% chance of critical failure. LV.9~10 10% chance of success. 10% chance of failing. 50% chance of revert. 30% chance of critical failure. Meaning; Chance of success-The equipment is now on that level. Chance of failing-The equipment remains in the level it was and the stone&money is lost. Chance of revert-The equipment is reverted back to level 5 regardless of the currient level. Chance of critical failure-The equipment is reverted to a random of level 0~5 and will never be able to be refined in this manner again. Why not break..?C'mon...after getting an elite through questing or finally buying a donation equipment, you really want it to be completely wasted? As for how to obtain the stones...what about they be questing itens in which you need something like...200 Rough Winds to make one(1) Wind Emerald? Needs to be tough... And the price for each trial could easily be...equipment currient level+1*1kk zenny ^^ *looks up in what wrote* hnnn...sometimes...things like these can happen when i see a suggestion that sparkles ideas in a moment where i have nothing else better to do XD Edited August 28, 2009 by Sorrow
Adamxd Posted August 28, 2009 Report Posted August 28, 2009 Chance of critical failure-The equipment is reverted to a random of level 0~5 and will never be able to be refined in this manner again.<------ HMm if someone is gonna sell this item buyer will not know what kind of it is right?
Kittie Posted August 28, 2009 Report Posted August 28, 2009 uh What about players who already have items +10? Well nowadays i think items +10 are cheaper than+0 becuz of thana rape right? It's impossbile for our lovely server. Isn't there a way to server-wide degrade everything to 0?
Adamxd Posted August 28, 2009 Report Posted August 28, 2009 well im not specialist but i think it's not possible. And who will upgrade items? SOmeone who wanna be raped by thana users? Go ahead.
Rayray Posted August 28, 2009 Report Posted August 28, 2009 (edited) my reflect paladin got all gears +10... and i think thana users often die before i die.. so upgrading gears is not ALWAYS a bad thing. i agree on the others about the catalyst having a chance to fail instead of breaking the armor and i agree on putting it the same with the original chance of the refiner. but yeah massive coding on it Edited August 28, 2009 by calintz1218
Yuki Posted August 28, 2009 Report Posted August 28, 2009 (edited) uh What about players who already have items +10? Well nowadays i think items +10 are cheaper than+0 becuz of thana rape right? It's impossbile for our lovely server. For this suggestion, +10'ing an item wouldn't mean increasing defense. I believe it would be a special upgrade, so defense wouldn't probably be increased. What if...Instead of fixed bonuses to the pieces of equipment we had separate stone/minerals to add certain abilities? As in... Fire Ruby>+1 STR Wind Emerald>+1 DEX Water Saphire>+1 INT Earth Topaz>+1 VIT Light Diamond>+3 AGL Dark Amethyst>+5 LCK That way it could help some complement their builds(like exemple;in my prof, my int ends with a 6...and i really can't seem to get the +4 i need to complement the multiple of 10 thingy...) AGL and LCK are higher because everyone know that they don't make any difference at all unless they are in (very)high numbers. Compatibility; some pieces of equipments can only be changed with certain stones. Like Helmet* accepts Ruby(STR), Emerald(DEX) and Water(INT). Armors accept only Topaz(VIT). Cloacks&Boots go for Diamond(AGL) and Amethyst(LCK). One thing; Each peice of equipment can only be upgraded with ONE stone and one stone only. *Helmet; only the top headgear can be refined...or one headgear that uses more slots than one. Chance of fail; They would be high on higher levels...this way making normally boosts for stats to round up builds would be easy, but making the max boost to add up to an alread round up build would be very difficult. Could work like this... LV.0~1 50% chance of success. 50% chance of failing. LV.1~2 45% chance of success. 55% chance of failing. LV.2~3 40% chance of success. 60% chance of failing. LV.3~4 35% chance of success. 65% chance of failing. LV.4~5 30% chance of success. 70% chance of failing. LV.5~6 20% chance of success. 70% chance of failing. 10% chance of revert. LV.6~7 10% chance of success. 70% chance of failing. 20% chance of revert. LV.7~8 10% chance of success. 50% chance of failing. 30% chance of revert. 10% chance of critical failure. LV.8~9 10% chance of success. 30% chance of failing. 40% chance of revert. 20% chance of critical failure. LV.9~10 10% chance of success. 10% chance of failing. 50% chance of revert. 30% chance of critical failure. Meaning; Chance of success-The equipment is now on that level. Chance of failing-The equipment remains in the level it was and the stone&money is lost. Chance of revert-The equipment is reverted back to level 5 regardless of the currient level. Chance of critical failure-The equipment is reverted to a random of level 0~5 and will never be able to be refined in this manner again. Why not break..?C'mon...after getting an elite through questing or finally buying a donation equipment, you really want it to be completely wasted? As for how to obtain the stones...what about they be questing itens in which you need something like...200 Rough Winds to make one(1) Wind Emerald? Needs to be tough... And the price for each trial could easily be...equipment currient level+1*1kk zenny ^^ *looks up in what wrote* hnnn...sometimes...things like these can happen when i see a suggestion that sparkles ideas in a moment where i have nothing else better to do XD I actually really like where you're going with this. The gemstones seem like a really great idea, and having it only apply to a certain armor really sounds interesting as well. Although it reminds me of another game (different from RO), it actually sounds really appealing if we were to add it here, on fRO. The stats of the gemstones seem semi-fair. I think probably after refine rate 5, it would start increasing by 2 INT. And then at 9~10, it would increase by 3 INT. So, if you were to calculate this, it would end up being a total of 17 INT. Take into consideration that the percentages of reaching +10 refine rate is extremely low, so I think we should make the stats worth-while to have. About the idea of having a percentage to break, it seems alright to have it break. I would expect to see many tickets and complaints about "omg gm pls return my f armor!! i keep refining and den wen i refine to 9... it dissapear! pls return!! " If that were to happen, we'd probably add to the NPC, "Warning: You are about to refine it to +8 with a 10% chance to break, are you willing to take the risk?" and it would give a few warnings before you actually refine it. So personally, if we were to add the percentage to break, it should be lower. Overall, the refine rate list seems fine to me. The quest idea sounds great as well, if we could make it an interesting quest, it'd be interesting to do. Chance of critical failure-The equipment is reverted to a random of level 0~5 and will never be able to be refined in this manner again.<------ HMm if someone is gonna sell this item buyer will not know what kind of it is right? We can color code the +'s. For example, taking Kusanagi's example with the Fire Ruby (STR) for the helm, it wouls appear as a red + refine rate in front of the item. Example : +10 Blue Imperial Valkyrie Helmet Isn't there a way to server-wide degrade everything to 0? Yes, I believe there is a way. It should be similar to the Valkyrie Exchanger NPC, where it takes your item and exchanges it for a new one. So for example, if we had like a +10 Forsaken King Armor, we would have to go to this new NPC and select the item that you have and exchange it for a completely new one. But since this idea is most likely for Forsaken King Gear and Elite Gears, it's going to be a long list for the NPC, and a lot of coding. well im not specialist but i think it's not possible. And who will upgrade items? SOmeone who wanna be raped by thana users? Go ahead. It's possible. It's just going to take massive amounts of coding. Literally, massive. Again, it will not always have to affect defense. Sorry for the long post. Edited August 28, 2009 by Venus
» Pat Posted August 28, 2009 Report Posted August 28, 2009 Yes, I believe there is a way. It should be similar to the Valkyrie Exchanger NPC, where it takes your item and exchanges it for a new one. So for example, if we had like a +10 Forsaken King Armor, we would have to go to this new NPC and select the item that you have and exchange it for a completely new one. But since this idea is most likely for Forsaken King Gear and Elite Gears, it's going to be a long list for the NPC, and a lot of coding. I'm not 100% sure because I'm really not much of a programmer but I think this could be done by using an SQL query à la UPDATE fkarmors SET fkingarmor='Forsaken King's Armor' WHERE fkingarmor='Forsaken King's Armor+10' I'm not even 50% sure tbh so idk.
